So Im having baby feeding problems

[DollysMom]

Blue dawn. At this point follow your instincts and best judgement based on the reading you've done and knowledge you've gained of your little snake. No one knows him better than you at this point or has a higher stake in his welfare. I wish you all my best.

 

[Giga]

Well feeding out of his usual home didn't work; can't hurt to try feeding him in the tank. I just pop the front half of the mouse into whichever hide they're hiding in. It's less stressful to them than hooking them out of their nice comfy hides whenever it's time to try and feed, so you can just slot it in without worrying about leaving a few days to settle, and who knows, perhaps without being disturbed by that, he'll feel comfy enough to eat. Might be that at this point he associates being taken out the tank with stress.

Failing that, and failing pinky heads, it might be time to assist feed.

 

[smale492]

Well feeding out of his usual home didn't work; can't hurt to try feeding him in the tank. I just pop the front half of the mouse into whichever hide they're hiding in. It's less stressful to them than hooking them out of their nice comfy hides whenever it's time to try and feed, so you can just slot it in without worrying about leaving a few days to settle, and who knows, perhaps without being disturbed by that, he'll feel comfy enough to eat. Might be that at this point he associates being taken out the tank with stress.

Failing that, and failing pinky heads, it might be time to assist feed.

so do you suggest another whole xs pinky or just the head put in his tank?

 

[Giga]

Well, not seeing the snake or the pinky, it's difficult to say. Do you have the weight of either to hand?

Having said that, it's very rare for a corn to require just pinky heads, so my instinct is to suggest you try feeding in his home with an entire XS pinky and then move onto heads in deli cups, and then assist feeding.

 

[smale492]

Well, not seeing the snake or the pinky, it's difficult to say. Do you have the weight of either to hand?

Having said that, it's very rare for a corn to require just pinky heads, so my instinct is to suggest you try feeding in his home with an entire XS pinky and then move onto heads in deli cups, and then assist feeding.

Ok sounds good. I think I sent a picture some where in this thread but maybe not. I dont know the weight saddly but I shall just try a full xs pinky again in his tank

 

[smale492]

So I tired last night to feed him in his home. I un thawed a pinky and put it on a napkin under his favorite hide and it went untouched all night. Today I decided to put some leafs on one side of his tank because maybe it would make the tank seem less open and maybe him less stressed. I dont know what to do next in the feeding process? Try feeding in tank but have the pinky with the dawn method (and we have dawn I just dont know what kind to use)? Or what should I do... Im getting nervous.. he still seems active cruising around his tank but he seems just to go along the sides going up and down the glass but then reverts to climbing around. Is that a sign of stress or is that just babies being babies trying to escape?

 

[axis1]

So I tired last night to feed him in his home. I un thawed a pinky and put it on a napkin under his favorite hide and it went untouched all night. Today I decided to put some leafs on one side of his tank because maybe it would make the tank seem less open and maybe him less stressed. I dont know what to do next in the feeding process? Try feeding in tank but have the pinky with the dawn method (and we have dawn I just dont know what kind to use)? Or what should I do... Im getting nervous.. he still seems active cruising around his tank but he seems just to go along the sides going up and down the glass but then reverts to climbing around. Is that a sign of stress or is that just babies being babies trying to escape?

Hi smale492! How ya been?

What you described sounds just like typical behavior for hatchlings. My little ones sometimes cruise around even after they've eaten, until morning light (dawn) when they usually go and hide. However, speaking of Dawn (the soap, not the time of day), maybe it's that time? What I do is pour boiling water with a nice drop of Dawn mixed in beforehand over the pinkies without making them really soapy. I think the clean-scent doesn't put off the hatchlings like some freshly-thawed out pinkies can. Another way is to squirt some Dawn in a cup and run some water into it until it's nice and sudsy and then simply thaw the pinkies out in it without rinsing them off. However, I find a higher rate of success with the boiled water method. Just be sure to pour the boiling water OVER them and don't actually IMMERSE the pinkies in the boiling water, as described in some of the earlier posts in the thread (specifically post #4 where HerpsOfNM gives detailed directions).

Whatever you DO or DON'T DO, DON'T GIVE UP! This morning at 3am, 2 of the 3 hatchlings I described in post #9 that hatched during the week of July 11th, FINALLY ate a day-old pinky! This was after trying and failing for about 6 or 7 weeks!! I must have gone through at LEAST 30 pinkies just trying to feed these stubborn little hatchlings, having also assumed they were just probably doomed to perish as some hatchlings do as a part of natural selection or survival of the fittest. But every time I approached the process of trying to feed them, I did so with the hope I'd be successful. Takes a lot of patience sometimes! I'm aware that you didn't breed your snakes like I did, which is a separate issue and one that highlights how hatchlings shouldn't be sold until they have eaten at least 3 or more times, but since you do have a hatchling who is stubborn and are not returning it, I don't see why you shouldn't approach it in a similar way.

So DON"T GIVE UP!!!

 

[smale492]

Hi smale492! How ya been?

What you described sounds just like typical behavior for hatchlings. My little ones sometimes cruise around even after they've eaten, until morning light (dawn) when they usually go and hide. However, speaking of Dawn (the soap, not the time of day), maybe it's that time? What I do is pour boiling water with a nice drop of Dawn mixed in beforehand over the pinkies without making them really soapy. I think the clean-scent doesn't put off the hatchlings like some freshly-thawed out pinkies can. Another way is to squirt some Dawn in a cup and run some water into it until it's nice and sudsy and then simply thaw the pinkies out in it without rinsing them off. However, I find a higher rate of success with the boiled water method. Just be sure to pour the boiling water OVER them and don't actually IMMERSE the pinkies in the boiling water, as described in some of the earlier posts in the thread (specifically post #4 where HerpsOfNM gives detailed directions).

Whatever you DO or DON'T DO, DON'T GIVE UP! This morning at 3am, 2 of the 3 hatchlings I described in post #9 that hatched during the week of July 11th, FINALLY ate a day-old pinky! This was after trying and failing for about 6 or 7 weeks!! I must have gone through at LEAST 30 pinkies just trying to feed these stubborn little hatchlings, having also assumed they were just probably doomed to perish as some hatchlings do as a part of natural selection or survival of the fittest. But every time I approached the process of trying to feed them, I did so with the hope I'd be successful. Takes a lot of patience sometimes! I'm aware that you didn't breed your snakes like I did, which is a separate issue and one that highlights how hatchlings shouldn't be sold until they have eaten at least 3 or more times, but since you do have a hatchling who is stubborn and are not returning it, I don't see why you shouldn't approach it in a similar way.

So DON"T GIVE UP!!!

Do you suggest trying to put the pinky in the hide again with or without a napkin? The napkin it was on seemed to be a little to abstructing but who knows. Or do I try to feed him in a deli cup even though it seemed to freak him out? Also does it matter what dawn I use? we have some for of blue dawn we use for dishes.

 

[axis1]

Do you suggest trying to put the pinky in the hide again with or without a napkin? The napkin it was on seemed to be a little to abstructing but who knows. Or do I try to feed him in a deli cup even though it seemed to freak him out? Also does it matter what dawn I use? we have some for of blue dawn we use for dishes.

Hiya smale492! How ya been?

Please don't take this the wrong way, but I think you may be making yourself TOO anxious, which - BELIEVE IT OR NOT! - your little hatchling can perceptively pick up from you! Try to be patient and to act with confidence, as you'll be surprised how far this will take you. Of course, this is just my opinion and while I don't know you aside from your posts, I'll admit that this information is largely educated guesswork on my part. If I am wrong, I apologize. I just seem to perceive something between the lines, if you catch my drift. No offense intended, and certainly no harm can come outta what I'm telling you as I am only trying to help. I, myself, am naturally wound tighter than a ball of rubber bands and am therefore more anxious than a hooker in a cathedral on a normal day! Take it from one who knows, your snakes can sense anxiety.

That being said, I think your chances are higher if you place your snake in a deli cup or any other small container that will compel the snake to literally face it's food item. However, place him in the deli cup or container and give him a suitable amount of time to decompress or to calm down some. I put mine in a dark dresser drawer out of sight from each other, as I usually am feeding multiple hatchlings. I also believe that the smaller size of a container is one of the reasons the boiling method works so effectively. It MUST have something to do with their negative experience with the scent of a dead prey item. This is what some if the articles I've researched suggest anyways. So PRIOR to using Dawn, I would try to present your snake with a heated or slightly boiled pinky. HerpsOfNM more than adequately provides a detailed set of instructions on how to do this in post #4 of this thread, neatly cut, copied, & pasted for your convenience below:

The following blurb is an edited version of post #4 of this thread:

. . . Armed with this deli cup, find a small dark box or other solid-colored container that will fit the deli cup. The idea here is a makeshift hide. Next, get a piece of regular 8.5 x 11 paper. This will be the lid to our makeshift hide.

Assuming you have some frozen small pinkies on hand, thaw the smallest 1 out. Next, if you live at home mom/dad are about to love you... in a small pot boil about a cup of water. While waiting for water to boil, place the snake into the deli cup, deli cup into box, and cover box with piece of paper. Using a strainer, place pinkie into it and once water is boiling, pour CAREFULLY the boiling water over the pinkie. You're only going to pour enough to cause a slight color change to the pinkie - you don't want to cook the entire pinkie! You won't need the whole cup of water to accomplish this.

Pat the pinkie mostly dry with a paper towel. I do this with gloves on to avoid any of my scent on the pinkie. Next use tweezers to remove the pinkie off paper towel and place into the deli cup with the snake.

For the first 2 hours, check every 20-30 minutes ONLY by lifting the piece of paper up enough to see if the pinkie is still in the deli cup or if it's been consumed. If consumed, congrats! If not, leave everything set up and undisturbed. Keep checking every 20-30 minutes. If nothing after 3-4 hours, stop checking and let the snake and pinkie become buddies overnight. Hopefully it ate overnight, if not repeat this in 5 days.

If it's still refusing to eat, then I'd start working my way down Nanci's problem feeder page. . .

As per HerpsOfNM's instructions, I would proceed with Nanci's suggestions, or actually the method of using the Dawn as she instructs, ONLY after you try offering a pinky the way HerpsOfNM describes in the above-edited blurb.

It's worked for me ever since I read and tried it. The 3 non-eaters I was struggling with as I mentioned also in this thread in post #9 have ALL eaten with this method! They were approaching TWO whole months without EVER eating! I believe that the smaller day-old pinks I purchased locally were also fresher and that, combined with HerpsOfNM's detailed instructions, all made a difference!

So from one who has reaped the rewards of suggestions and advice of more experienced and knowledgeable herp lovers, I'm just passing my experiences on towards anyone who might be able to use some help themselves!

I sincerely hope this helps!

 

[DollysMom]

Oh Axis1, I know this thread is about smale492, but congrats on the three non-feeders eating. I knew two had eaten, but all three? Awesome.

Btw, sometimes they just don't like a certain supplier. (Not to cast aspersions on any supplier-- each case is individual). Maybe that was a factor?

 

[smale492]

Hiya smale492! How ya been?

Please don't take this the wrong way, but I think you may be making yourself TOO anxious, which - BELIEVE IT OR NOT! - your little hatchling can perceptively pick up from you! Try to be patient and to act with confidence, as you'll be surprised how far this will take you. Of course, this is just my opinion and while I don't know you aside from your posts, I'll admit that this information is largely educated guesswork on my part. If I am wrong, I apologize. I just seem to perceive something between the lines, if you catch my drift. No offense intended, and certainly no harm can come outta what I'm telling you as I am only trying to help. I, myself, am naturally wound tighter than a ball of rubber bands and am therefore more anxious than a hooker in a cathedral on a normal day! Take it from one who knows, your snakes can sense anxiety.

That being said, I think your chances are higher if you place your snake in a deli cup or any other small container that will compel the snake to literally face it's food item. However, place him in the deli cup or container and give him a suitable amount of time to decompress or to calm down some. I put mine in a dark dresser drawer out of sight from each other, as I usually am feeding multiple hatchlings. I also believe that the smaller size of a container is one of the reasons the boiling method works so effectively. It MUST have something to do with their negative experience with the scent of a dead prey item. This is what some if the articles I've researched suggest anyways. So PRIOR to using Dawn, I would try to present your snake with a heated or slightly boiled pinky. HerpsOfNM more than adequately provides a detailed set of instructions on how to do this in post #4 of this thread, neatly cut, copied, & pasted for your convenience below:

The following blurb is an edited version of post #4 of this thread:


As per HerpsOfNM's instructions, I would proceed with Nanci's suggestions, or actually the method of using the Dawn as she instructs, ONLY after you try offering a pinky the way HerpsOfNM describes in the above-edited blurb.

It's worked for me ever since I read and tried it. The 3 non-eaters I was struggling with as I mentioned also in this thread in post #9 have ALL eaten with this method! They were approaching TWO whole months without EVER eating! I believe that the smaller day-old pinks I purchased locally were also fresher and that, combined with HerpsOfNM's detailed instructions, all made a difference!

So from one who has reaped the rewards of suggestions and advice of more experienced and knowledgeable herp lovers, I'm just passing my experiences on towards anyone who might be able to use some help themselves!

I sincerely hope this helps!

Thanks for the help and yeah I am a little nervous since it has never taken this much effort to feed. Saddly I already tried the boil method with a small deli cup to no avail. I will try again I just though maybe trying it with the dawn may help? Either way I will try again tonight to hopefully success.

 

[axis1]

Thanks for the help and yeah I am a little nervous since it has never taken this much effort to feed. Saddly I already tried the boil method with a small deli cup to no avail. I will try again I just though maybe trying it with the dawn may help? Either way I will try again tonight to hopefully success.

Just my experience, but the only times I was successful with Dawn, it was used with pinkies that I had immersed in boiling water very briefly (this was before I learned that it's better to pour the boiling water OVER the pinkies as opposed to immersing them in it). Just something to think about. When I DID try it, I do remember how quickly the hatchlings seemed to go after the pinky treated with Dawn! It was like they only NOW had noticed it was food! That's why I believe that boiling and treating with Dawn actually removes a scent from the pinkies that would otherwise offend the hatchling in question. When you think about it, makes sense, doesn't it?

In any case, why not try it? You certainly have nothing to lose!

Good luck!!

 

[smale492]

Just my experience, but the only times I was successful with Dawn, it was used with pinkies that I had immersed in boiling water very briefly (this was before I learned that it's better to pour the boiling water OVER the pinkies as opposed to immersing them in it). Just something to think about. When I DID try it, I do remember how quickly the hatchlings seemed to go after the pinky treated with Dawn! It was like they only NOW had noticed it was food! That's why I believe that boiling and treating with Dawn actually removes a scent from the pinkies that would otherwise offend the hatchling in question. When you think about it, makes sense, doesn't it?

In any case, why not try it? You certainly have nothing to lose!

Good luck!!

Thanks and any dawn works?

 

[axis1]

Thanks and any dawn works?

I would think the concentrated blue formula is probably the best, since that's the only one I ever used and the only one I know of that works. However, at this point, I'd use whatever's available! Try it, you might just be pleasantly surprised!!

 

[DollysMom]

Yes, Blue Dawn.

 

[smale492]

I would think the concentrated blue formula is probably the best, since that's the only one I ever used and the only one I know of that works. However, at this point, I'd use whatever's available! Try it, you might just be pleasantly surprised!!

Ok I will let you know what happens when I try tomorrow

 

[smale492]

So sorry for the update but things are still not seeming to work out... So a few days ago I tried feeding him with dawn method in a deli cup... idk if it was the daw smell or maybe it as stress or a combo of the two but I think he may have regurged. Now Im not sure but when I checked in the morning the pinky was kinda slimy and a little liquid was near it. It also seemed to be missing a little chunk in its stomach idk if that was from digestion or from him biting at it accidentally. Idk what to do next maybe try again without dawn, or maybe smaller pieces? also could I maybe have not rinsed enough of the dawn off ith the boiling water since the mouse still kinda had the smell of dawn ( may have just been my hands but who knows.) Please any help would be lovely he is still active at night and slithers around and climbs so no noticeable changes in activity.

 

[axis1]

So sorry for the update but things are still not seeming to work out... So a few days ago I tried feeding him with dawn method in a deli cup... idk if it was the daw smell or maybe it as stress or a combo of the two but I think he may have regurged. Now Im not sure but when I checked in the morning the pinky was kinda slimy and a little liquid was near it. It also seemed to be missing a little chunk in its stomach idk if that was from digestion or from him biting at it accidentally. Idk what to do next maybe try again without dawn, or maybe smaller pieces? also could I maybe have not rinsed enough of the dawn off ith the boiling water since the mouse still kinda had the smell of dawn ( may have just been my hands but who knows.) Please any help would be lovely he is still active at night and slithers around and climbs so no noticeable changes in activity.

Sorry that you're going through that smale492. I can't tell ya EXACTLY what makes a hatchling decide to eat, as it boggles the mind at the unpredictability of some of them. As I might have told you, I had 3 just begin to eat for no apparent reason other than I fed them at 2:30am as opposed to earlier in the night! I mean, I wouldn't SOAK the pinkies in Dawn, just immerse them in soapy water, rinse 'em off briefly, and serve 'em. Oh yeah, the ones I immerse in soapy water are the ones I pour the boiling water over, not just a thawed pinky! If they're too big for your snake, try just a head! Put the item & the hatchling in a deli cup with holes, place in a drawer and don't disturb for a half hour. If still uneaten, just close the drawer for like 3 hours until you check again.

Sorry for the lack of undamaged synapses in my brain, but I don't remember, when was the last time your sneaky one ate? (You may have to think about force feeding or contacting a vet who can pump a liquefied pinky into it. If your snake has a better or stronger immune system or system in general, it MIGHT provoke a feeding response. Some food for thought, no pun intended!).

You also could research or look up Nanci's recommendations for stubborn eaters. The Dawn was her suggestion in the first place. Wish I could make another suggestion. Good luck!

 

[smale492]

Sorry that you're going through that smale492. I can't tell ya EXACTLY what makes a hatchling decide to eat, as it boggles the mind at the unpredictability of some of them. As I might have told you, I had 3 just begin to eat for no apparent reason other than I fed them at 2:30am as opposed to earlier in the night! I mean, I wouldn't SOAK the pinkies in Dawn, just immerse them in soapy water, rinse 'em off briefly, and serve 'em. Oh yeah, the ones I immerse in soapy water are the ones I pour the boiling water over, not just a thawed pinky! If they're too big for your snake, try just a head! Put the item & the hatchling in a deli cup with holes, place in a drawer and don't disturb for a half hour. If still uneaten, just close the drawer for like 3 hours until you check again.

Sorry for the lack of undamaged synapses in my brain, but I don't remember, when was the last time your sneaky one ate? (You may have to think about force feeding or contacting a vet who can pump a liquefied pinky into it. If your snake has a better or stronger immune system or system in general, it MIGHT provoke a feeding response. Some food for thought, no pun intended!).

You also could research or look up Nanci's recommendations for stubborn eaters. The Dawn was her suggestion in the first place. Wish I could make another suggestion. Good luck!

It has never eaten (or is thought too since I got him very young) So I may try again tonight and see if he eats

 

[axis1]

It has never eaten (or is thought too since I got him very young) So I may try again tonight and see if he eats

Ouch! Sorry to hear that smale492! That sucks worse than getting sand in your motion lotion! :face_palm_02: Nothing to do except be patient & persistent! Whatever you do or DON'T do, please don't give up! Sometimes being patient pays off!

Have you checked out the stickies and threads by the gurus of feeding and other problems? It's a little time-consuming, but well worth it for the information you will acquire! Nanci also posted a great video clip on tease- or slap-feeding. You just have to make the time and check out as much as you can find that relates to your particular problem.

In any event, if all else fails, a competent herp vet can probably tell you the pros & cons of force-feeding and may even be able to teach you how to use a pump to feed liquefied pinks to your little sneaky one! (In retrospect, I WISH I'd have known this when I was struggling with two of my hatchlings last year that NEVER ate, not even once! Force-feeding mouse tails without giving adequate time in-between feeding sessions is probably what killed one of them. Needless to say, I was devastated!).

These problems are one of the MAIN REASONS a pet store or breeder shouldn't sell a hatchling until it has eaten 3 to 5 times at the very least!!! Anyone who does that and isn't somehow supportive to the new owner should be publicly humiliated and flogged!

:my2cents_01:

Like I said before, DON'T GIVE UP!!!! (A watched pot never boils, right?).