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"You lie!" - Disrespect or expression of an opinion?

tsst said:
One of the things I have been trying to say has been that they seem to be trying to disassociate those fringe members. If his membership was to do what the traditionalist side does why should he have to quit...
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To save space, I only quoted part of your post. he rest doesn't need to be argued...

IF the group is disassociating itself from the lunatics and fringe, than I asy good for them. And I certainly would not expect Wilson to seperate himself from a group that he truly believes in. Here's my problem...

This isn't really all that "publicized", in that I am not seeing it in the news or in any other websites, to be honest. So we've no way of knowing, and we will never get the answers to our questions.

I believe that it is absolutely within reason for him to be questioned regarding where his loyalties lie. I also believe that the answers to these questions are very important, regardless of whom asks the them or the words used. To me...it doesn't matter if they ask, "Are you a racist? Do you support the actions and ideals of the racists within your group?" or "Are you a traditionalist? Do you suport the traditional faction of your group?" To me, it doesn't matter HOW the question gets asked, only that it gets asked...and answered.

It's semantics. You think "we" are implying and attempting to defame. OK. Whichever way you word the questions, there IS going to be an implication. In their current state the implication is that he supports them. In your proposed state, it implies that he does not. Either qway and implication. It's just a question of whether you want the questions to have a positive or negative "spin".

It's also fair enough to assume that conservatives will want a posiive spin, and liberals will want a negative spin. C'est la vie. That's the way the ball bounces in partisan politics...
 
tyflier said:
... So...that relates to being a member of a society that advocates the enslavement of a different race, seeks to "purify" the white race, and seeks to stamp out "injustice" by ridding the world of "lesser" races how? I fail to see even the most remote correlation.
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There was no correlation intended.

tyflier said:
Contrary to what you might believe, I don't have to agree with everything about America to love America. And if I disagree with something this country is doing, I have every right to state that as my opinion, both publicly and privately.
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Nor have I ever said or even implied that. I don't myself nor would I encourage anyone else to follow that blindly! I also never said you couldn't state your opinion. In fact I engaged you in discussion to more fully understand your opinion. Where the heck are you coming from on this?

tyflier said:
Show me a clip where Obama and this minister are drawing a map, plotting an attack, and piecing together bombs in order to launch a terrorist attack, and I'll believe they are a terrorist organization. Don't show me a clip of a man that is angry at an unjust law, and try to convince me he is anti-America. That's just ludicrous. Typical...but ludicrous none the less...
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uhhhh oooooookkkkkkkk
:confused: :sidestep:

Not sure where you are trying to go with the terrorist thing. I never said he was a terrorist. :shrugs:

By the way he did not say god damn this law, he said "god damn America". Sounds pretty straight forward where he places blame.
 
tyflier said:
... IF the group is disassociating itself from the lunatics and fringe, than I asy good for them. And I certainly would not expect Wilson to seperate himself from a group that he truly believes in. Here's my problem...

This isn't really all that "publicized", in that I am not seeing it in the news or in any other websites, to be honest. So we've no way of knowing, and we will never get the answers to our questions.

I believe that it is absolutely within reason for him to be questioned regarding where his loyalties lie. I also believe that the answers to these questions are very important, regardless of whom asks the them or the words used. To me...it doesn't matter if they ask, "Are you a racist? Do you support the actions and ideals of the racists within your group?" or "Are you a traditionalist? Do you suport the traditional faction of your group?" To me, it doesn't matter HOW the question gets asked, only that it gets asked...and answered.
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I agree as a public servant he should explain his loyalties. They are not asking him they are doing just what any extremist does, using only the questions from that side, in a rhetorical fashion, to paint a picture.

tyflier said:
It's semantics. You think "we" are implying and attempting to defame. OK. Whichever way you word the questions, there IS going to be an implication. In their current state the implication is that he supports them. In your proposed state, it implies that he does not. Either qway and implication. It's just a question of whether you want the questions to have a positive or negative "spin".
Click to expand...
In my proposed state all the questions would be posted not just one side.

tyflier said:
It's also fair enough to assume that conservatives will want a posiive spin, and liberals will want a negative spin. C'est la vie. That's the way the ball bounces in partisan politics...
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Agreed.
 
tsst said:
There was no correlation intended.

Nor have I ever said or even implied that. I don't myself nor would I encourage anyone else to follow that blindly! I also never said you couldn't state your opinion. In fact I engaged you in discussion to more fully understand your opinion. Where the heck are you coming from on this?

uhhhh oooooookkkkkkkk
:confused: :sidestep:

Not sure where you are trying to go with the terrorist thing. I never said he was a terrorist. :shrugs:

By the way he did not say god damn this law, he said "god damn America". Sounds pretty straight forward where he places blame.
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All of those quote were in regards to the video you posted. It's intent was obvisouly to portray Obama and the Priest(or whatever he is) as som,e sort of anti-American terrorist something-or-other. Unless you linked to a different video.

I was using "my opinion" in general. The Minister/priest/whatever has every right to state his own opinions regarding this country and how he feels within the confines of his own club.

Again...all of those quotes are directly related to your posting of that ridiculous video...
 
tyflier said:
All of those quote were in regards to the video you posted. It's intent was obvisouly to portray Obama and the Priest(or whatever he is) as som,e sort of anti-American terrorist something-or-other. Unless you linked to a different video.
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The videos intent may have been that. My intent in linking it was just simply being a little sarcastic to the the quote in that post.

tyflier said:
I was using "my opinion" in general. The Minister/priest/whatever has every right to state his own opinions regarding this country and how he feels within the confines of his own club.
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Agreed. Both of you have the right. It's one of the wonderful things about 'damn America'. :grin01:

tyflier said:
Again...all of those quotes are directly related to your posting of that ridiculous video...
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I agree he was a little ridiculous in the video. :roflmao::sidestep:
 
tsst said:
The videos intent may have been that. My intent in linking it was just simply being a little sarcastic to the the quote in that post.
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Changes the light of the post, but not the sentiments of my words.

Agreed. Both of you have the right. It's one of the wonderful things about 'damn America'. :grin01:
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I love it enough to try and make it better. How about you?

I agree he was a little ridiculous in the video. :roflmao::sidestep:
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No more ridiculous than you and the rest of the conservative crew have been lately. I love it...when it is pro your beliefs, you can say and/or do whatever you want. When it is against your beliefs, it's unAmerican. Typical. Sad, detrimental, and just a little scary...but typical...
 
tyflier said:
... I love it enough to try and make it better. How about you?
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ABSOLUTELY that includes fighting to stop things that I believe will make it worse right along with fighting for things that I believe will make it better. Change for change sake only is a garbage philosophy.

tyflier said:
No more ridiculous than you and the rest of the conservative crew have been lately. I love it...when it is pro your beliefs, you can say and/or do whatever you want. When it is against your beliefs, it's unAmerican. Typical. Sad, detrimental, and just a little scary...but typical...
Click to expand...
I am not conservative. I am a libertarian that leans left or right based solely on the issue at hand. Paint me how you feel you must to feel better about your position but I will not participate in your little personal attacks. If you want to continue on trying to prove your side a more valid point I will participate. But if the best you have got when you are frustrated is to call me ridiculous, sad, typical, scary I will just move one. By the way, to the best of my recollection, I have never called anyone unAmerican. If you see that in one of my posts link it and I will apologize.
 
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