Amel or sunglow stripe? help!

[The_evil]

I bought this guy three years ago on an reptile show here in Sweden..

bought as an amel stripe (I just fell in love with his darkred color)..
But with time I started to question if he´s "only" an amel stripe (I´ve never seen a amel stripe like him), so I started to call him an sunglow stripe..

i´m I wrong?! I would really like some opinions!

 

[Josua]

First of all, that is a very nice dark red amel stripe.

Sunglow is the term for a selective bred amel with no (to very little) white in them, but without any type of hypo in them.
A amel stripe always lacks the white color of them (except for the belly off course), so you don't have to breed amel stripeds selectively in order for them to have no white.

So you can't really have a sunglow stripe, because basically all amel stripeds are sunglows / without white.

 

[Blue Apple Herps]

So you can't really have a sunglow stripe, because basically all amel stripeds are sunglows / without white.

Oh you most certainly can have a sunglow stripe. It depends on the intensitity of the oranges. There are some amel stripes who have somewhat muted oranges. Then there are others who have very bright vibrant oranges.

Here is a picture of my sunglow stripe and amel stripe for comparison. You can really see the difference in the intensity of their oranges:

 

[Duff]

I have to agree with Josua on this one. I also think the same applies to amel motlies always been labelled as sunglow.

 

[Blue Apple Herps]

I have to agree with Josua on this one. I also think the same applies to amel motlies always been labelled as sunglow.

Amel motleys are not always labeled as sunglow. There's a reason that Don has both sunglow amel motleys and amel motleys. There is a difference between the two; with stripes and motleys its not an "Is there white" issue, but a "how vibrant are the colors?" that distinguishes the two.

 

[Ssthisto]

Sunglow is the term for a selective bred amel with no (to very little) white in them, but without any type of hypo in them.

I was under the impression that an Amel with no white and rich red and orange colouration - whether or not it's homozygous hypo - is a Sunglow.

Certainly I know that some people deliberately use Hypo in their sunglow mix to reduce border thicknesses.

 

[The_evil]

Alright! Thanks for answering..
I seen many sunglow stripes who looks exactly like him but not a single amel stripe..
Don't know much about genetics unfortunately, that´s why a forum like this is so good to have!

 

[Tula_Montage]

Theres nothing different in the genetics of an amel stripe and a sunglow stripe. BOTH are homo amel and stripe.

Its the intensity of the colours that define sunglows whether they are regular amels, amel mots or amel stripes. You get that intense look through selective breeding.

The fact is they are all technically amel corns. So I don't see the big deal about labeling them otherwise and causing confusion.

 

[Pasodama]

The fact is they are all technically amel corns. So I don't see the big deal about labeling them otherwise and causing confusion.

In some cases, I have found myself wondering "why" on some color/name discussions.
However, I can see a need to have different names for certain different phenotypes.
Reverse Okeetees, Sunglows, Candy Canes, etc., etc. are all Amels (selectively bred).
So, if someone wants a Candy Cane (desires that "look"), and requests an Amel, they will, certainly, be disappointed when a regular Amel shows up at their doorstep.
Same goes with the Sunglow. If someone were to desire a Sunglow Stripe, and requests an Amel Stripe, they may be a little disappointed in receiving a less vibrant Amel.

It also helps to have different names, for different phenotypes, because it saves "breath" and other forms of confusion. One can simply tell the breeder that they wish to order a, let's say, Candy Cane and the breeder knows exactly what they want ... rather than the potential buyer having to go into a longer, perhaps drawn out, explanation of just which Amel ("look") they want (&, with this, there could exist a possibility of confusing the breeder/seller, if there is not a complete meeting of the minds, and the buyer still not receiving exactly what they were seeking ).

 

[Blue Apple Herps]

The fact is they are all technically amel corns. So I don't see the big deal about labeling them otherwise and causing confusion.

The same could be said about okeetees, miamis, upper keys, etc. They're all just normal corns, and it causes some confusion (every now and then you'll see a reg corn labeled het miami or something). I think they need different names to designate the differences. As the above post said; reverse okeetee, candycane, sunglow, etc are all distinctively different looking. Just my 2¢

 

[Velvet]

I think you most certainly do get sunglow motleys and stripes, I've seen sunglow motleys and personally owned a sunglow stripe. You can definitely tell the difference! lol

MAGNIFICENT snake by the way! WOW! That is singly the nicest stripe I have seen! I love the dark reds!

I vote Sunglow stripe.

 

[The_evil]

It´s a difficult question for me
Sunglows are amels, that i know.. But sunglows are darker and have more color, but they´re amels still.

Thank you for complimenting him, his truly beautiful!
Unfortunately he´s sick right know, but on his way to recovery!

 

[wax32]

I agree, beautiful snake, whatever you decide to call it. :grin01:

 

[El Jefe]

Let me throw a wrench in all of this....don't forget some people refer to sunglows ONLY if there is hypo in there! :sidestep:

 

[Jynx]

Unfortunately, Jeff is right... which is basically the origin of the confusion when it comes to "sunglow." A thorough breeder will however give details about the genetics of the snake. Some will say "sunglow" and yet some will say "hypomel" etc etc.

Personally, if I spent the time & effort in selectively breeding sunglows, someone better not call it just an amel. Since we are dealing with a pattern morph in this snake, the "as little white as possible" aspect can be kicked out when trying to determine him a sunglow. In reference to the intense colors that sunglows are bred to have, I think you have it dead on. Sunglows aren't just intense orange... I've spoken to many a respected breeder and the high level of intensity in ANY color expressed is what makes a sunglow a sunglow. What colors do amels express (other than white)... well, there's yellow, red, orange... color of fire... hey, the sun is made of fire (see where I'm going with this?)

In short, I would say that your amel is a sunglow, whether the breeder intended him to be or not. Yes, the genetics say plainly "amel" but the traits make him a sunglow.