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Deformed Hatchling..

PurraLovesJazz

PurraLovesJazz

Poofy-Headed Snake-Addict
(yes, I live and I'm back.. I know I died. )

So I got a bunch of corn eggs from my friend Kim, and I've been incubating them, and the last couple days they've been hatching :) which is pretty neat, I've got 14 healthy ones so far from two different clutches.

unfortunately, from the first clutch, there's a messed up baby... :/ his head is slightly misshapen like he has a forehead. he/she was laying part way out of the egg for about a day, and I knew something was wrong from the head shape alone. But he was alert and I thought I'd give him a chance, see what happened. he never came all the way out of the egg so today I cut it open...

106_0501.jpg

106_0502.jpg


His body is bent in on itself in a U shape and his stomach is all joined together... he struggles to pull himself around. His spine all moves how its supposed to, but with his stomach joined, it just flops him around.

Now... I know he wont survive, theres no way he could eat, etc. And it would be cruel to let him starve. But I dont know how to do it... what in your opinion is a humane way to euthanize him/her?
 
I'm sorry that I can't help,- don't know enough yet - but I just wanted to say I am so sorry for the little guy,
Marsha
 
aww the poor lil guy. :crying:
if you cannot put him down by CO2 or have a vet do it, deep freeze.
 
Sorry about the little one. :(

I've heard that one way to euthanize is to put them in the refrigerator first. After they are unconscious, put them in the freezer.
 
I'm so sorry to see that. Poor little guy. :(

I have heard the refrigerator>freezer method as well, not sure how humane it is, but it seems kinder than going straight to the freezer. C02 would be the preferred way to do it, if feasible.
 
Co2 or exhaust fumes from a car. It's the same as the Co2, he'll just fall asleep and never wake up. It's how they kill minks and other animals they use for the fur trade so they don't damage the animal and because it's humane. I've seen them do it on TV. They go in the box, 30 seconds later they're dead. The camera was in the box. The minks went in, laid down and died.

That may be an option so long as you don't have CO2 available.
 
Hmm. Breaks my heart to see a small beautiful snake like that. :( I dont know how to euthanize it. Sorry to hear that. Poor little guy.
 
Co2 chamber would be best. If you have the stomach for it you could cut off his head. I mean, it's one of the quickest ways I can think of to die.

I am very skeptical about refrigerating/freezing being humane. I would like to see a study or something on it. I mean, for mammals you get very very cold, then numb, then warm, then pass out/die. But that's mammals. Who's to say they can't feel the ice crystals forming in the veins? I can't imagine that being painless. BUT I don't personally know.
 
Reptiles go into a stupor in the cold, much the same as mammals. And because their bodily functions are dependent upon an outside source of heat, they'll probably die much faster than a mammal would, thus no chance really of feeling themselves freezing.

Snakes and other reptiles are really good at holding their breath. Thus, while a CO2 chamber would work eventually, anyone know how long it would be? Certainly more than a mere 30 seconds.

I have euthanised two hatchlings via the freezer. They weren't contorted in strange positions as if they'd been in pain... they were just curled up and had been turned into snakecicles.
 
CO2 is humane, and it's easy to do if you have dry ice available. Refrigeration followed by freezing is supposed to be humane for herps; though I can't cite a study off the top of my head there have been some. Cutting off a snake's head is NOT actually a humane or quick death, contrary to popular opinion. Snakes have evolved to deal with low oxygen conditions due to cold and/or brumation. They can live for hours with head and body separated, and that's bound to be painful IMHO. A crushing blow to the skull will cause immediate death if you can stand to do it. Hard on the human, but seemingly not on the snake.

I'm sorry you have to go through this.
 
I dunno, if the head wasn't attached to anything it wouldn't feel anything but the neck wound. Plus, there's a difference between moving/biting after death and actually being alive. I can't see the brain living for more than 40 seconds.

And yes, I can see a Co2 chamber taking longer than it would for a mammal. I'd leave it in for a 5-10 minutes just to be super sure.
 
VickyChaiTea said:
I dunno, if the head wasn't attached to anything it wouldn't feel anything but the neck wound. Plus, there's a difference between moving/biting after death and actually being alive. I can't see the brain living for more than 40 seconds.

And yes, I can see a Co2 chamber taking longer than it would for a mammal. I'd leave it in for a 5-10 minutes just to be super sure.
Click to expand...

I don't dispute what would be "felt" by a decapitated head. The neck would would be painful enough, I should imagine. However, according to Stephen Barten, DVM "Decapitation is an easy way to kill a reptile in that no special equipment or drugs are necessary. Nevertheless, the brain of a decapitated reptile may remain active for up to an hour, so decapitation by itself is inhumane. It may be used if the brain is pithed, or destroyed by the insertion of a probe, immediately afterwards." http://www.anapsid.org/euth.html

There are many articles available on this topic. Short answer - decapitation is NOT a quick death for a snake, and logically is not painless.
 
Shiari said:
Reptiles go into a stupor in the cold, much the same as mammals. And because their bodily functions are dependent upon an outside source of heat, they'll probably die much faster than a mammal would, thus no chance really of feeling themselves freezing.

Snakes and other reptiles are really good at holding their breath. Thus, while a CO2 chamber would work eventually, anyone know how long it would be? Certainly more than a mere 30 seconds.

I have euthanised two hatchlings via the freezer. They weren't contorted in strange positions as if they'd been in pain... they were just curled up and had been turned into snakecicles.
Click to expand...

A chamber filled with CO2 and devoid of oxygen would literally take 30 seconds or so for a human to die. In slaughter, it's second only to a bolt through the head. It takes longer for larger animals, such as sheep or cows, which is why they use the bolt method (it's also not practical to find a container big enough to fill with CO2 for larger animals)

Get a plastic tub. Cut an exhaust pipe sized hole in the side. Seal the tub and place the exhaust over the hole so the tub fills with gases. When it's filled (around 10 seconds or so) open the tub, place the poor thing in the tub, close it again and wait 30 seconds. He'll be dead before 30 seconds. :(
 
thanks you guys, I'll go with the car exhaust method I think. I really dont think I could bear to put the poor thing in the freezer unless I had to... it seems unpleasant, and would break my heart more than the co2
 
Kryten said:
He'll be dead before 30 seconds. :(
Click to expand...

No, he will NOT be. Reptiles can hold their breath and hold it a loooong time. A crocodile that is inactive can stay underwater for nearing 2 hours. And they breathe in response to lowered internal oxygen levels, not increased C02 levels like in humans. Please note that laboratories, when euthanising reptiles, do NOT include C02 as humane. Admittedly, they don't freeze them either, but instead use euthasol.
 
VickyChaiTea said:
Co2 chamber would be best. If you have the stomach for it you could cut off his head. I mean, it's one of the quickest ways I can think of to die.

I am very skeptical about refrigerating/freezing being humane. I would like to see a study or something on it. I mean, for mammals you get very very cold, then numb, then warm, then pass out/die. But that's mammals. Who's to say they can't feel the ice crystals forming in the veins? I can't imagine that being painless. BUT I don't personally know.
Click to expand...
Don't cut off the head! Snakes survive headless for quite some time. You've never seen a decapitated rattlesnake head keep trying to bite?
 
Know anyone who has a milk or kingsnake? seems like that would be the fastest way, and his death wouldn't go to waste, since all the other ways seem to have a downside and aren't very good.
 
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