How good an indicator for het diffused/stripe/motley...

[tbtusk]

Well I have been wondering if my two year old ultramel het caramel 50% ph motley is actually het motley. She has a clear stripe down the middle of her belly, a marker suggesting she is het, but as has been said rather often, this is not a definite sign. So I was wondering. It seems we often look at the bellies of snakes who are het or one of these traits and often find the clear stripe down the middle, but how often do we look at snakes that are definitely NOT het motley/stripe/diffused and check their ventral patterns?

This question boils down to how accurate are these marks, but since I know that has been asked before and the answer I'll get is most likely "who knows" or something similar, I want to ask something a little more particular. Have any of you run across a non-het motley/diffused/stripe who has this belly pattern marker? Have you ever bought a possible het with the marker then found later through test breeding that they are in fact NOT het for one of these traits?

I'm hoping everyone will say "no never happened," run and check their collection, and find out that this is a pretty efficient way to check for hets, but for some strange reason I doubt that'll happen....

 

[ghosthousecorns]

Just to throw something else in the mix, the upper keys also tend to have the clear bellies or a line down the middle.
TBH I have not noticed the clear bellies or lines down the middle on any of my hets for motley or stripe though :shrugs:

 

[Susan]

I've never seen any marker for het motley or stripe, only het caramel and het bloodred, and they are not always accurate as many that are definitely het will not show the markers, and vice versa.

 

[TripleMoonsExotic]

I also never have seen a "marker" for Motley or Stripe (in the hundreds of Motley & Stripe hatchlings I've produced over the years). I think you may be confusing the belly pattern marker some have suggested being seen in hets for Diffusion. Either way, markers are in now way at all an accurate method for determining hets.

Three seasons ago (I think) I produced two Charcoals that had a clear stripe down the belly and were in no way related to Motley, Stripe or Diffusion. I thought it was pretty strange, but in reality they were nothing but Charcoals het Amel with an unusual belly. I don't recall if their were any mold on the eggs that could have effected the phenotype.

 

[tbtusk]

Ok, thanks guys. I do know that diffused is the he thats related to the stripe down the middle of the belly, but I was pretty sure I'd heard that the same could be found on het motleys and het stripes. Three of my snakes which are het motley or stripe all have the similar stripe down their bellies, and I guess that is what influenced my question.

 

[Roy Munson]

I agree with those who have said that the belly-line isn't a reliable marker for anything-- even bloods. As I understand it, the pigment migration for a developing snake starts at the spine and ends with the middle-line of the ventral surface. Any interruption of this pigment migration (environmental or genetic) could create a situation where the belly checkers don't meet.

 

[tbtusk]

I agree with those who have said that the belly-line isn't a reliable marker for anything-- even bloods. As I understand it, the pigment migration for a developing snake starts at the spine and ends with the middle-line of the ventral surface. Any interruption of this pigment migration (environmental or genetic) could create a situation where the belly checkers don't meet.

I've heard this before. I've been curious how stripe, motley, and diffused actually effect the pattern considering that they appear to be slowing the movement of the pigment during the development so that it doesnt cover the belly of the snake. Or the pigment may be stopping its movement sooner.