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I have a question for breeders.
- Thread starter thrawn
- Start date
strawberry_bunny
meep
On a small scale I dont think you would make much if any money, I havent bred corns but I have bred beardies, I didnt make money I think I barely broke even but I did enjoy the experience. So alsong as you enjoy it and its something you want to try then does it really matter if you make money?
Justin Guyer
New member
I bought a house because it had the perfect facilities to keep a good number of herps. But back in those days all I wanted to do was keep a collection that I would really enjoy working with, I wasn't even thinking about breeding.
Then in 2005 I decided to pair up a couple of Corns just to 'test the waters' and really just to see if I could possibly breed them. I hatched 14 out of 16 eggs that year and started a (IMHO) good looking line of Ghost Corns.
After that I was hooked. This year I hatched around 200 baby Corns, a clutch of Desert Kingsnakes, some Ball Pythons, and I have Russian Tortoises hatching as we speak.
The first thing I want to say is that running a breeding operation is NOT EASY. If you decide to go the breeder route get used to not having any free time and get used to spending long days feeding and cleaning. I'm sure that just about every breeder on here can tell you stories about cleaning rodent cages at 2:00AM.
Also you've got to figure your overhead. Can you come up with the cash to buy what you need for caging? Rodents and rodent feed? New aquisitions?
The best advice I can give is to start out small and slowly work your way up as far as numbers go. The last thing that you want to do is to overwhelm yourself. Can you take care of a large collection PROPERLY while going to school or working full time? Who is going to take care of your livestock if you have to go out of town or if you get sick?
Also do not produce any more hatchlings than what you can care for for about a year's time. They don't move fast. They trickle out the door. Right now I'm selling on average 1-2 snakes a week. Do not expect for people to come rushing to your door to buy your babies as soon as they hatch....it is probably not going to happen that way. Breeding reptiles is just like any other business...you have to work for sales.
What are you going to do if a customer is not happy with their purchase and you don't have any animals to replace it with and have already spent the money that you made from that sale?
If a person starts a reptile breeding operation because they think that they are going to make wads of cash.....Its probably not going to happen, and that person is doing it for the wrong reason anyhow. If you don't absolutely love the animals and love working with them, you are doomed to fail.
It takes what I like to call the 3 "Ps" to be successful
Passion
Patience
Persistance
As far as making money goes, this is my 5th season of breeding and I am still losing money. So get ready to lose your butt the first few years....you will be spending more than what you're making from the animals.
So how do you start breeding? Well, you just start by doing it. Spend a LOT of time on forums and sites like this one...learn all you can. You can't be a breeder and be stupd if you're going to be in this game for any amount of time.
Also make a LOT of good contacts. Get to know people and let them get to know you and be honest and upfront about who you are and what you have going on. I am fortunate enough to know a good many fellow herpers and it doesn't matter what new site I decide to join, I know that there is going to be a good number of people there who already know me either through other forums, business deals, emails, phone calls, or whatnot. Because I've taken the time to make good contacts I also am fortunate enough to be taken to 'secret spots' when field herping every year and I can get deals on animals from many breeders that most other folks are not going to get.....So take the time to make a lot of good contacts in the herp community.
Never forget that if you breed crap, you're going to produce crap....So spend the extra bit of cash to get high quality breeding stock. Nobody wants to buy crap...except maybe the wholesalers who will thouroughly rape you on price if you want to move your animals.
I have to really hand it to Rich and to every other pro breeder out there. It is HARD to try to make a living out of this, especially early on. I'm finding this out the hard way.
I don't think that I can answer your questions any more honestly than I have here and I hope that this tidbit helps.
Don't get discouraged though..if this is what you want to do. For the chosen few, breeding reptiles is definitly worth it.
I get asked all of the time why I breed reptiles. it is because I nned that feeling of seeing the babies pop out of the eggs.....better than opening Christmas presents. I need that rush. I am addicted to it and have to have that fix. I have to every single season produce morphs and breed new species that I have never done before. I have to challenge myself to know if I've got what it takes...can I successfully breed this or that? What happens when you combine these different traits? I have to to find the answers to those questions. So far I have lost thousands of dollars every year pursueing this and I don't know how soon I will start to be making any profit....and I don't care!!! I've still got to do it because it is a calling, something I've got to have in my life. I'm a breeder plain and simple. The other breeders will understand what I just said.
What it comes down to really is whether or not you NEED this in your life.....don't even think about money at this point. Do you need to find out if you can breed those snakes or not? Is that question bugging you the the point that you're having trouble sleeping?
If it is than you need to go for it!!
You miss every shot that you never take.
Then in 2005 I decided to pair up a couple of Corns just to 'test the waters' and really just to see if I could possibly breed them. I hatched 14 out of 16 eggs that year and started a (IMHO) good looking line of Ghost Corns.
After that I was hooked. This year I hatched around 200 baby Corns, a clutch of Desert Kingsnakes, some Ball Pythons, and I have Russian Tortoises hatching as we speak.
The first thing I want to say is that running a breeding operation is NOT EASY. If you decide to go the breeder route get used to not having any free time and get used to spending long days feeding and cleaning. I'm sure that just about every breeder on here can tell you stories about cleaning rodent cages at 2:00AM.
Also you've got to figure your overhead. Can you come up with the cash to buy what you need for caging? Rodents and rodent feed? New aquisitions?
The best advice I can give is to start out small and slowly work your way up as far as numbers go. The last thing that you want to do is to overwhelm yourself. Can you take care of a large collection PROPERLY while going to school or working full time? Who is going to take care of your livestock if you have to go out of town or if you get sick?
Also do not produce any more hatchlings than what you can care for for about a year's time. They don't move fast. They trickle out the door. Right now I'm selling on average 1-2 snakes a week. Do not expect for people to come rushing to your door to buy your babies as soon as they hatch....it is probably not going to happen that way. Breeding reptiles is just like any other business...you have to work for sales.
What are you going to do if a customer is not happy with their purchase and you don't have any animals to replace it with and have already spent the money that you made from that sale?
If a person starts a reptile breeding operation because they think that they are going to make wads of cash.....Its probably not going to happen, and that person is doing it for the wrong reason anyhow. If you don't absolutely love the animals and love working with them, you are doomed to fail.
It takes what I like to call the 3 "Ps" to be successful
Passion
Patience
Persistance
As far as making money goes, this is my 5th season of breeding and I am still losing money. So get ready to lose your butt the first few years....you will be spending more than what you're making from the animals.
So how do you start breeding? Well, you just start by doing it. Spend a LOT of time on forums and sites like this one...learn all you can. You can't be a breeder and be stupd if you're going to be in this game for any amount of time.
Also make a LOT of good contacts. Get to know people and let them get to know you and be honest and upfront about who you are and what you have going on. I am fortunate enough to know a good many fellow herpers and it doesn't matter what new site I decide to join, I know that there is going to be a good number of people there who already know me either through other forums, business deals, emails, phone calls, or whatnot. Because I've taken the time to make good contacts I also am fortunate enough to be taken to 'secret spots' when field herping every year and I can get deals on animals from many breeders that most other folks are not going to get.....So take the time to make a lot of good contacts in the herp community.
Never forget that if you breed crap, you're going to produce crap....So spend the extra bit of cash to get high quality breeding stock. Nobody wants to buy crap...except maybe the wholesalers who will thouroughly rape you on price if you want to move your animals.
I have to really hand it to Rich and to every other pro breeder out there. It is HARD to try to make a living out of this, especially early on. I'm finding this out the hard way.
I don't think that I can answer your questions any more honestly than I have here and I hope that this tidbit helps.
Don't get discouraged though..if this is what you want to do. For the chosen few, breeding reptiles is definitly worth it.
I get asked all of the time why I breed reptiles. it is because I nned that feeling of seeing the babies pop out of the eggs.....better than opening Christmas presents. I need that rush. I am addicted to it and have to have that fix. I have to every single season produce morphs and breed new species that I have never done before. I have to challenge myself to know if I've got what it takes...can I successfully breed this or that? What happens when you combine these different traits? I have to to find the answers to those questions. So far I have lost thousands of dollars every year pursueing this and I don't know how soon I will start to be making any profit....and I don't care!!! I've still got to do it because it is a calling, something I've got to have in my life. I'm a breeder plain and simple. The other breeders will understand what I just said.
What it comes down to really is whether or not you NEED this in your life.....don't even think about money at this point. Do you need to find out if you can breed those snakes or not? Is that question bugging you the the point that you're having trouble sleeping?
If it is than you need to go for it!!
You miss every shot that you never take.
bitsy
Owned by Corns since 1991
I started with a male and two females many years ago (Normals) but they turned out to be a pretty poor group. Consistently turned out largely infertile clutches and a high proportion of non-feeders in the egs that actually hatched. Thankfully I bought them as pets - gave up and didn't start breeding again for another five years.
You're unlikely to make money on established morphs as you'll have a lot of competition which will ultimately drive prices down. Also, how much you get for your snakes will depend on how you plan to sell them. Wholesale to a shop will get you much less than their retail price. Privately over the internet will incur shipping costs and might make you uncompetitive. Privately "collection-only" is probably the way to maximise your profit, but you're then reliant on that many people in your area being interested in Corn Snakes, plus you get the hassle of strangers tramping through your home.
High-end morphs will make the most money, but will cost you big bucks to buy in the first place. They'll also lose value fast, as other people will be breeding them at the same time as you, again driving the cost down. For example, I bought two GoldDust hatchlings a few years ago for £500 each. By the time they were old enough to breed, they were selling in the UK for less than £200 each and I was getting significantly less than that from the shop I sold them to. On the other hand, I have a deal with them where I get all food and equipment from them at trade price, so they're well worth my while dealing with.
I currently have 14 adults, which include four breeding female Corns. I make enough money from breeding each year to cover food, vet bills and replacement equipment for all of them, with enough left to buy a couple of decent meals out. I call that a win.
In short - don't go into it for the money unless you want a warehouse full of them! And if you search for threads started by Rich Z (the proprietor of this site and a retiring commercial breeder), then you'll find out all about the downsides of a large-scale operation. Breeding Corn Snakes for a living is a labour of love. You won't get rich and you'll end up working 12+ hours a day, seven days a week.
You're unlikely to make money on established morphs as you'll have a lot of competition which will ultimately drive prices down. Also, how much you get for your snakes will depend on how you plan to sell them. Wholesale to a shop will get you much less than their retail price. Privately over the internet will incur shipping costs and might make you uncompetitive. Privately "collection-only" is probably the way to maximise your profit, but you're then reliant on that many people in your area being interested in Corn Snakes, plus you get the hassle of strangers tramping through your home.
High-end morphs will make the most money, but will cost you big bucks to buy in the first place. They'll also lose value fast, as other people will be breeding them at the same time as you, again driving the cost down. For example, I bought two GoldDust hatchlings a few years ago for £500 each. By the time they were old enough to breed, they were selling in the UK for less than £200 each and I was getting significantly less than that from the shop I sold them to. On the other hand, I have a deal with them where I get all food and equipment from them at trade price, so they're well worth my while dealing with.
I currently have 14 adults, which include four breeding female Corns. I make enough money from breeding each year to cover food, vet bills and replacement equipment for all of them, with enough left to buy a couple of decent meals out. I call that a win.
In short - don't go into it for the money unless you want a warehouse full of them! And if you search for threads started by Rich Z (the proprietor of this site and a retiring commercial breeder), then you'll find out all about the downsides of a large-scale operation. Breeding Corn Snakes for a living is a labour of love. You won't get rich and you'll end up working 12+ hours a day, seven days a week.
Carinata
Ever Evolving Exotics
I am looking forward to breeding. My goal is to develope a good line of Bloodreds. I am getting a Granite (Anery A + Bloodred). I am going to slowly get into it. I mean I knwo some pretty cool breeders (Guyer!) who give me tips all the time. It is good to know someone before you jump into the breeding thing. I will have a clutch of corns this year.
ZoologyGirl
Under Tank Heather
I want to breed but the number one reason is for the satisfaction, enjoyment, and love of the species. I do not plan on making any money, especially in the first few years when my breeding plans will be small. Any money I make in the future will just be a bonus.
You have to remember that you have to feed, house, heat, etc... all the little babies (and adults) plus any vet costs that may go into any complications. Now if you're breeding things like tesseras, pied sided, cinder morphs, etc... you might make a good piece of money...but with the more common morphs like normals, anerys, amels, snows, etc... I'd call it success if you break even, on the small scale at least. Large scale is a different matter.
You have to remember that you have to feed, house, heat, etc... all the little babies (and adults) plus any vet costs that may go into any complications. Now if you're breeding things like tesseras, pied sided, cinder morphs, etc... you might make a good piece of money...but with the more common morphs like normals, anerys, amels, snows, etc... I'd call it success if you break even, on the small scale at least. Large scale is a different matter.
I don't plan to breed until a few years maybe. I just want to try for fun. I always liked snakes, so I don't want to breed them just for money. I want to give that passion of snakes to other people, with good snake. I don't want to have a large scale breeding things, I would lost fun and I would not be sure to have enough time to really take care of all those snakes.
Thanks for all your answers, it's really interesting!
ps: I'm french so hum...maybe there a few sentence that are not that good.
Thanks for all your answers, it's really interesting!
ps: I'm french so hum...maybe there a few sentence that are not that good.
wendhend
Kind of Corny
For me, breeding corn snakes is totally a hobby thing, which I enjoy because I really love snakes. I started out with one pair of hatchling corns from the first expo I ever attended, thinking it might be fun to breed them someday if I could. When they got big enough they did breed, and I still remember how exciting it was when their first clutch hatched. All the babies were perfect, ate readily and sold very quickly when I advertized them in the local paper. I was hooked and started purchasing more corn snakes and researching corn snake genetics. I was really intrigued by the variety of morphs that can be produced and that fact that as a breeder you get the pick of the litter (clutch). After several years of hobby breeding, I decided I might as well turn it into a small home business. That way I could write off the expenses for my hobby and expand to a nation-wide customer base by creating a business website. Of course designing my own website also allows me to enjoy my other favorite hobby, which is art. My "real job" as a registered nurse pays really well, and I honestly don't really care if I make much profit on the snake business. Usually what happens with the profit I do make on the snake business it that I end up reinvesting it in purchasing fancier high-end snakes, which will be future breeders. My permanent collection of snakes is around 60 right now, and I really don't want to get much bigger. Otherwise my hobby might start feeling like a lot of work, and that would take some of the fun out of it. Over all, I feel like breeding is worthwhile for the satisfaction you get out of keeping and producing nice animals.... but I definitely wouldn't rely on it as a steady source of income!
