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Motley stripe? Pinstripe????

rosewood

rosewood

Dedicated Reptile Lover
So as some of you know I posted some pics of Midas a while ago thinking he was a motley stripe however most said pinstripe motley after look at the pics. The breeder told me his dad was a GD stripe and his mom a GD het stripe/motley. But I read some where that you can have a snake that is a motley/stripe but you cant have one that is het for both motley and stripe just one or the other. Is that true?
I have looked at pics of motley/stripes and pinstripes and it looks to me that he really could be either of them.
I am getting better with genetics but havent looked too much into patterns yet and this whole motley and stripe thing is getting a little confusing cuz I keep hearing different things.
 

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A corn snake can indeed be het motley AND stripe. What it cannot be is homo motley het stripe and vice versa. When you see a snake described as motley/stripe, assuming the breeder is being accurate, then the snake is het for motley AND stripe. The reason the appearance looks motley is because the alleles for motley and stripe reside on the same locus.

As for your snake, it could either be a hetero motley/stripe showing the pinstripe phenotype, or it could be a homo motley showing the pinstripe phenotype. The only way to tell would be to breed you animal to a known homo stripe. If you get any stripes as a result then youll know that your animal is a motley/stripe.
 
Looks like a trundlefart (motley/stripe) to me!

Generally, stripe/stripe snakes will have no "q-tipping", the areas where the stripe widens and narrows. This is generally found with kiddos with at least 1 motley gene. It is possible to have motley/motley with an almost complete stripe, but there is almost always this q-tipping. Assuming the stripe parent is a homozygous stripe, I vote trundlefart.

Awesome looking snake!

Also, you cannot be both het motley and het stripe without being a trundlefart, so if mom was normally-blotched, I vote het motley!!
 
I might just have to pick me up a stripe this summer :p He has a date with my butter het hypo once they are both of age :)
 
He's beautiful! and yes I'd call that a pin-stripe, not sure if I can get into the 'trundlefart" term though lol
 
Pinstripes & Q-tip are motley and often incorrectly referred to as motley stripe. Cubed, sunspot, and vanishing pattern are selectively bred variations of stripe. If you're having difficulty distinguishing stripes from motley stripes or motley, I suggest you get a copy of the cornsnake morph guide.:idea:

One simple way to tell if your specimen is striped or motley stripe is the central stripe. Striped specimens the center stripe connects with the head.

The center stripe is usually broken on the neck on pinstripes & Q-tip motley .

I'm getting pretty frustrated with people who just don't care if they are incorrectly identifing their specimens. "I'll call it a stripe even if it isn't because that's what I want it to be".:rolleyes:

Trundlefart is becoming a pretty good description anymore!:cool:
 
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This is a motley, absolutely, positively no stripe, homo or het, involved.
 

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This snake was sold to me as a stripe. Researching her pedigree, she appears to be a motley. Het stripe, IIRC. I wanted stripe only genes, so I sold her as questionable- probably motley, possibly stripe, to someone who didn't care about the motley gene.

This is a perfect case of "It looks like a stripe, I'll sell it as a stripe" which caused trouble for someone (me) down the line. Luckily she was registered so I could check her out.
 

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Nanci said:
This is a motley, absolutely, positively no stripe, homo or het, involved.
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Nice pinstripe! An absolute motley. Why? First notice how thin the central stripe is, then notice how it has a thin black border on the stripe. In addition to the above please notice that the motley, motley/ stripe lacks the four thin stripes on the dorsal and side patterns that a true striped corn possesses.

The second example that Nanci provided lacks the four thin stripes. Therefore it is not a stripe but is a motley/stripe.

Thanks Nanci for providing such great examples.
 
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tsthompson said:
Pinstripes & Q-tipped are both motley/striped. Cubed, sunspot, and vanishing pattern are selectively bred variations of stripe. If you're having difficulty distinguishing stripes from motley stripes or motley, I suggest you get a copy of the cornsnake morph guide.:idea:

One simple way to tell if your specimen is striped or motley stripe is the central stripe. Striped specimens the center stripe connects with the head.

The center stripe is usually broken on the neck on pinstripes & q-tipped (aka motley/stripe).

I'm getting pretty frustrated with people who just don't care if they are incorrectly identifing their specimens. "I'll call it a stripe even if it isn't because that's what I want it to be".:rolleyes:

Trundlefart is becoming a pretty good description anymore!:cool:
Click to expand...

Could you clarify the sentence I high-lighted in bold? It sounds as if you are saying that any pin-striped or q-tipped motley has to have one motley and one stripe gene (your use of "motley/stripe"). This is incorrect, as far as I understand. Both the pin-stripe and q-tipped pattern can be found in homozygous motleys. The stripe gene does NOT have to be involved.
 
Susan said:
Could you clarify the sentence I high-lighted in bold? It sounds as if you are saying that any pin-striped or q-tipped motley has to have one motley and one stripe gene (your use of "motley/stripe"). This is incorrect, as far as I understand. Both the pin-stripe and q-tipped pattern can be found in homozygous motleys. The stripe gene does NOT have to be involved.
Click to expand...

Thanks Susan! I corrected my hastily written earlier post.:eek: Pinstripe motley and Q-tip motley are often incorrectly called motley/stripe. The pinstripe motley & Q-tip motley are currently being used to describe the phenotype not the genotype. The genotype for both is motley.

In order to have a striped /motley one parent would need to be striped & the other motley. The striped allele is believed to act as a recessive to motley.
 
tsthompson said:
Thanks Susan! I corrected my hastily written earlier post.:eek: Pinstripe motley and Q-tip motley are often incorrectly called motley/stripe. The pinstripe motley & Q-tip motley are currently being used to describe the phenotype not the genotype. The genotype for both is motley.

In order to have a striped /motley one parent would need to be striped & the other motley. The striped allele is believed to act as a recessive to motley.
Click to expand...

OK, I don't have to change my way of thinking! The way some "rules" change with regards to corn snake genetics, I just wanted to make sure you hadn't heard something that I missed!

And a weird thought just ran through my mind...considering how Sunkissed messes with the prototypical expression of both motley and stripe, I wonder if a Sunkissed "trundlefart" (Sunkissed with one motley and one stripe gene) will be something completely different than either homozygous phenotype?
 
So Tom, how do you explain the difference in stripe width between the Miami and the lavender?
 
Nanci said:
So Tom, how do you explain the difference in stripe width between the Miami and the lavender?
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I'm not convinced the lavender isn't a homozygous stripe. I'm not sure what Tom is seeing, but I see the classic 4 line stripes on her and the stripe width is classice homozygous stripe. I know what the history and lineage of the snake is, but I would wait for the results of breeding trials before calling it a motley. You can't always believe that what the ACR says is 100% accurate. I have some registered snakes of my own that needed information corrected after I had a few breeding trials.
 
Well, the person who bought her sold her to his brother, so who knows if we'll ever find out.
 
Perfect examples of why I never got into motleys, stripes, mot/stripes, "trundlefarts" etc ;). But (correct me please) motley and stripe works kind of like ultra and amel, i.e. "motley/stripes" being the equivalent of "ultramels", a visible "expression" of a het motley and stripe snake compared to a visible expression of a het amel and ultra...

Thanks for the clarifications everyone :*)
 
Well- I like the perfect pinstripe Miami and would like to make more!! That is my only motley project. I just like stripe better, and it's so much easier when the two aren't combined.
 
There's motley in the TS line, for good or ill...It's "low expression" at best, but it has been proven out. :/

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