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New controvesial topic... Is collecting corn snakes a "hoarding" behavior?

sober_serpents said:
well, i have 13 cats, 3 dogs and over 100 snakes... people think i am a hoarder... but none of my cats are "wild" they all have their mommy and daddy times... heck- most of them sleep in the bed with us... sometimes i wake up with 5 or more cats on or near me...
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Do you charge people to enter your house? :) :sidestep:
 
no :) i actually have more critters than that :) i also have 10 birds, 3 turtles, 2 iguanas, leopard geckos, rats, green anoles... and the worst pet of all?? (also the messiest) My husband!!! sometimes i have more critters than that with my rescue... at this time we are empty... (rescue wise) most people are trying to sell their animals and dont care if they go to bad homes b/c the economy.... oh well... business will pick up eventually i'm sure..
 
SnakesRule1234 said:
I don't think it really matters in their lives are longer in captivity... I think the best life for animals would be in the wild- like they were ment to be... kind of.
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There's a group for people who make statements like this. It's called PETA.

But seriously... don't you keep snakes??

(Also for the record, I am not sure that my snakes feel "warm and fuzzy" happy, but I do think they are fairly content in their vivs)
 
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SnakesRule1234 said:
I don't think it really matters in their lives are longer in captivity... I think the best life for animals would be in the wild- like they were ment to be... kind of.
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So is a feral pigeon in the wild, with a life expectancy of two years, better off than a rescue which is not released, leading a healthy, pampered but captive life of 20 years or more? (I had to make that decision once...)
 
Hypancistrus said:
There's a group for people who make statements like this. It's called PETA.

But seriously... don't you keep snakes??

(Also for the record, I am not sure that my snakes feel "warm and fuzzy" happy, but I do think they are fairly content in their vivs)
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No, PETA wants to kill animals... I don't. The fact that you even compared me to PETA, is pretty sad and I'm VERY offended and pissed right now.

Yeah, I keep a snake but I'm just wondering if they are really, truly, happy with the way they are being kept. Once again, if I was a snake, I would want to be out there living my life and not being kept in a small box.

I think I have made my point.
 
SnakesRule1234 said:
Yeah, I keep a snake but I'm just wondering if they are really, truly, happy with the way they are being kept. Once again, if I was a snake, I would want to be out there living my life and not being kept in a small box.
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PETA said:
Fragile tropical fish, who were born to dwell in the majestic seas and forage among brilliantly colored coral reefs, suffer miserably when they are forced to spend their lives in glass tanks. The same is true of river fish. Robbed of their natural habitats and denied the ability to travel freely, they must swim around in the same few cubic inches of water endlessly.
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PETA said:
The life for so-called “exotic pets” is far removed from what they would experience in their natural habitat. Big cats, primates, bears, and reptiles are just a few of the types of animals who have, unfortunately, become popular in the pet trade and easily obtainable. These are not domestic animals, and their instincts remain very much intact in captivity. A life in a backyard, basement or garage cage cannot even begin to meet these animals’ instinctual needs and desires, such as seeking a mate, raising young, hunting, basking in the sun, and establishing territories.
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And the HSUS on reptile pets... we all know they are in bed with PETA.

HSUS said:
To protect their health and yours, reptiles should not be pets. Wild animals are best left in the wild where they belong.
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Article

Also found this in my search and was mildly amused...

PETA said:
Snakes
Depending on the variety, snakes can live for decades and grow to lengths in excess of 5 feet. They require at least a 30-gallon tank, frequent checkups, and care by a veterinarian who specializes in reptiles. Fresh water and a spotless environment must be provided at all times. Most snakes are carnivorous. They are susceptible to a variety of parasites as well as blister disease, respiratory and digestive disorders, and mouth rot. Strictly controlled daytime and nighttime temperatures and the careful application of pesticides are required in order to guard against mite infestations.
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Have you folks carefully applied pesticides to your snakes today?
 
SnakesRule1234 said:
No, PETA wants to kill animals...
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NO, PETA wants every single animal on this planet to live """free""" lives in the wild removed from human control. That includes cows, horses, kitty kats, chickens and even hamsters. In the process of getting this message across they do kill animals.

D80
 
Hypancistrus, what is your point? That I share the same view as PETA on this particular subject (not even fully)? So what?

And D80, I read somewhere (I think it was a quote) where they said they don't actually care about animals- they think that humans are superior- so, that's pretty much what I meant... and the killing, like you mentioned.

I don't have a problem with cats and dogs and certain other animals, we all know that they have been breed for hundreds of years, and they are bred to be man's best friend.

Why can't you guys just accept my personal opinion? Why do you have to compare me to PETA, to which you KNOW I would not support, keeping snakes myself? I just find this so stupid... it's like Fauna all over again. I'm just so tierd of this... I think I should leave, and I see everyone is tierd of me here, too.
 
SnakesRule1234 said:
Hypancistrus, what is your point? That I share the same view as PETA on this particular subject (not even fully)? So what?

And D80, I read somewhere (I think it was a quote) where they said they don't actually care about animals- they think that humans are superior- so, that's pretty much what I meant... and the killing, like you mentioned.

Why can't you guys just accept my personal opinion? Why do you have to compare me to PETA, to which you KNOW I would not support,
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If you're going to argue/discuss something, you need to know the facts and be educated about them. Unfortunately, you're not aware of the facts about PETA. That's okay, just don't get upset and throw a fit when they're brought to your attention.

D80
 
well, i hope i dont offend anyone... But PETA also dont think that dogs should be used as "seeing eye or helping" dogs. But it makes people feel more independent having a best friend and pet help out instead of some stranger who might feel sorry for them...
~kin
 
Extremism are never a good thing and I consider PETA an extremist group.

SnakesRule1234, you said "I don't have a problem with cats and dogs and certain other animals, we all know that they have been breed for hundreds of years, and they are bred to be man's best friend," right? But didn't people had to start at some point? Wolfs or jungle-cats were not always man's best friend. They all had their behaviors modified somehow. Who knows if hundreds of years from now, snakes are going to seek human companion? How far fetched is this idea? :shrugs:

If you really mean what you wrote about snakes in captivity, just think about the chances your CB snake will have to survive in the wild. Maybe you should consider adopting it to someone with a huge vivarium instead.
 
SnakesRule1234 said:
Hypancistrus, what is your point? That I share the same view as PETA on this particular subject (not even fully)? So what?
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My point was only to show that what you initially said is also said by animal rights groups who are for all intents and purposes anti-pet. These groups want humans dead, or at the very least want animals to live their lives free from any type of human influence (the only way to achieve this being to get rid of humans). There are a lot of people who think these groups are harmless, but they're not. In fact, the FBI has several animal rights groups on its list of domestic terrorist organizations. Far from harmless.

You then denied that what you said was similar to what these groups say, to which I replied with some evidence that this was not true.

I guess I am just a little confused as to why a person who keeps a snake as a pet would agree with the AR groups that animals should not be kept in captivity. I am also confused as to why a person who feels this way would join a board of pet keepers.

I am unapologetically anti-animal rights... and if it looks like animal rights... and it smells like animals rights... well then, it probably IS animal rights.
 
Hoarding is when someone racks up animals of any kind but fails to take care of them; breaks the law by having way more than ordinances allow for or not having proper permits or zoning; and, does it all for irrational reasons, like trying to save every animal out of fear of harm or doom (something that no one can really do). It's a "mental" condition, I think.

P.S.- I totally agree with Hypancistrus above.
 
Again, it's a one word answer. Yes. Nowhere in the definition of the word Hoard or Hoarding is "lack of care" even mentioned!! :shrugs:

Why is hoarding perceived (which is opinion) as a bad thing? Just because some hoarders don't take care of their items doesn't mean the act of hoarding is bad. The analogies for this could be endless . . .

D80
 
. . . but you're missing my point. The hoarding of animals is not the problem. The lack of someone caring for them is what you are referring to. Sure, hoarding lots of animals may create the lack of care problem, but not necessarily. And . . .what's the limit to define hoarding?! 6 snakes for someone may create a situation for lack of care of hoarded animals . . . 6 snakes for me is a shipment from SerpenCo. :eek1:

Two separate issues, two separate terms, you're trying to meld them together into one. Take each as their own . . . Is collecting corns a hoarding behavior? Yes. Is not caring for animals in your care bad? Yes. Is hoarding cornsnakes bad? No.

:)
D80
 
Drizzt80 said:
Again, it's a one word answer. Yes. Nowhere in the definition of the word Hoard or Hoarding is "lack of care" even mentioned!! :shrugs:

Why is hoarding perceived (which is opinion) as a bad thing? Just because some hoarders don't take care of their items doesn't mean the act of hoarding is bad. The analogies for this could be endless . . .

D80
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LOL, true. But you're using the strict definition with nothing attached. I think the OP is talking about a psychological condition where people take on more animals than they can care for because they don't have any control. If I have the context wrong, maybe someone will tell me..

So really nobody's disagreeing here. I do hoard snakes like dragons hoard gold. That's a good thing IMO. But ask an animal control officer what "Pet Hoarding" is and you'll find a very different definition than what you posted. :cheers:
 
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