obese snake?

[Sweetseraph]

wow sweetseraph , such a criticizm and being judemental, asumeing I dont seem to care about my animal. i have the filter and water for few reasons...

I'm sorry if you felt criticized; most of what I said was just accepted fact. I could have pussy-footed around, but I was extremely concerned by what I saw you doing to the snake, so I felt I needed to come right out and be extremely clear. You don't handle a snake while it is digesting, especially just for some pictures. We could have waited. I'm actually more concerned with the size of mouse you are feeding your snake and you didn't address that, so I hope you took the advice and will not feed your snake too large a prey item in future. Too large a prey item and handling too soon after feeding both can cause the snake to regurge, which is very dangerous.

1: I gave her aplace to swim and relax. I find her often there (and its not because the other side is too hot, in my opinion, i think 74* on the 'hot' side is too cold...but this snake just might be differnt then your ordinary corn, i dont konw , but she seems happy. She takes a swim, a lot of corn snakes do that.

That's fine, I wasn't criticizing your water, just asking. If you're saying that your hot side is 74, you're absolutely right, that's nowhere near hot enough. She needs at least 80 in order to properly digest her food. But I'm not sure what you mean by "she seems happy"; snakes don't get happy. What you think means she's happy could mean she has mites. Yes, some corns like to go in their water, but sometimes it means they have mites and are trying to soak them off. It's worth checking in any case.

: It prevents me from haveing to give her fresh water every day becuase I have such a busy schedule. and the filter in there is to prevent the water from just siting out. when you have moveing water it prevents bacteria growth. It has been like that for 3 months, shes dong fine.

I'm not sure where you heard that, but moving water definitely does not prevent bacterial growth (or fish tanks would be a big fail, since they need bacteria to grow to work and in fact your filter filters partly by the bacteria that grow in the filter), so I hope you're not relying on that. This is actually what my concern was when I saw your pool; cleaning would be next to impossible. I bet if you run your finger on the side of the glass under the water that you will find it is slimy; that's bacteria. The snake will drink from it whether it's clean or not, since it's all that's available. If yours likes to go in the water, he probably poops in there too and the filter won't do anything for that. It's not necessary to change the snake's water every day anyways.

 

[coralife205]

just some plexiglas and silcone. alot of snakes like to swim, its in the corn snake nature..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCVkSYL_q-U

I cant find the video of the corn snake cage setup on youtube that gave me the idea. I was watching it and someone set up a whole water fall in there cage and foudn that there snake woudl spend most of its time in the water...now i know what your going to say..."well maybe the snake has mites or something"...not the case at all.

most the time when i put the snake back IN the cage, it goes right for lts little "spring" it loves it. and i love it more then the snake does because I dont have to give it new water every day from evaporation and worry about it not haveing enough humidity during a shed. when it sheds, i often find skin in the water. it does more good then harm. I recomend you all try it.

believe it or not, my snake will spend at least 3 miniuts under water, with out breathing...scared me for a while, but it knew whta it was doing. its so intresting to come home, look in the cage, and see its whole body underwater, with only its nose sticking out of the water, like an alagator waiting for a prey! lol

 

[coralife205]

okay people I have a problem.

the last time i fed my snake was around thursday, september 16th...becasue im trying to 'starve' her to swiitch to f/t.

I started seeing those 'hips' and so i thought she could be obese... I asked my co worker at work (petsmart) and he said it could be constapated...He told me to soak it in warm water...well i just did it. and almost immedetly it let out a big stool about an inch and a half long...underwater, and it looked normel, except that it dident spread everywhere like it normaly would. it came out as one big, twisted chunk. ..thats obviously an entire mouse...the snake has been getting ready to shed these lsat few days...but still, it has been about 10 days and it has not fully digested yet until i just 'forced' or 'helped' it too??????

am i mistaken in thinking there is something wrong????? cause i thought snakes digest in a 5 day period...and this last mouse, you could still see the lump after 2 days...it has eaten mice about that same size for a few months with out any problems before...at least i think..

 

[ShenziSixaxis]

Snakes never poo their last meal and be empty. Often times they'll get a little plump in the last part of their body from not stimulating their guts to produce a movement. What you described sounds normal to me.

Also, while it probably can't hurt to get a little weight off her (though she looks fine to me), 'starving' a snake isn't the best idea to switch to f/t, even if it does work and snakes aren't harmed in the long run. It does mess with their metabolism.

Did you try offering f/t normally? Did you thaw it in hot water or later heat it up to around 100F and then offer it? Try that. Also try slitting the back of the mouse so it bleeds, and the head so it bleeds and oozes brain matter. Corns go bonkers when they mess brain and blood.

While eating an over sized prey item can be done without any adverse affects, you are feeding more than what the snake should be eating, unless you are feeding very rarely (but then comes to metabolism thing again). However, an appropriate sized meal every week or so (7-10 days) is a better option. I think your snake should get a hopper sized mouse, or even a small weanling. What size f/t are you trying to feed?

 

[Sweetseraph]

'starving' a snake isn't the best idea to switch to f/t, even if it does work and snakes aren't harmed in the long run. It does mess with their metabolism.

What?!? You better let the wild snakes know that they need to eat regularly so their metabolism doesn't get messed with. He's "starving" it for 2 weeks, which is how often a lot of snakes get fed anyways. "Starving" it for 2 weeks is one of the best techniques. If the snake just ate a week ago, he might not be hungry enough to bother going for f/t. "Starving" it also allows it to finish digesting it's previous meal, which it obviously needed to do.

 

[coralife205]

nex time should i try to feed it two fuzzies in stead of 1 mouse?

 

[Sweetseraph]

Going by his weight, he should be fine with a hopper. Just monitor him and see if he digests that OK. You could also look into getting some Nutribac, which is a probiotic for reptiles, so it helps repopulate their digestive track with the good bacteria, which in turn helps digestion. It's a powder and you just roll the mouse in it to coat (shake and bake mouse, anyone??). You can also cut a few slits in the mouse, which allows the snake's digestive juices to get in there faster.

 

[Sweetseraph]

Oh, I should mention that I don't know if Nutribac is available in stores. I got mine from Bean Farm because I was ordering some other stuff. Kathy Love also sells it on her site.

 

[wstphal]

Umm, don't jump on the OP for the cool water feature in the vivarium. If the snake doesn't have mites, isn't getting scale rot and so on, why not? I have one snake who loves to get into the water bowl. Nobody else does it unless my apartment gets really hot, but I have 0.1 ghost who is a water baby. She is frequently in her bowl, so much so that I have to check it more often because she sloshes the water out. I've looked her over carefully many times, no mites. I even took away her big bowl for a week so she couldn't soak and looked again, no mites. Near as I can tell, she wants her own swimming pool, and if I was handy & had space for another display viv, I'd do what the OP did. Obviously, the water has to be changed regularly, but with this much water and the filter, it can go a couple days safely. And how many of us who have more than 1 or 2 corns change water every day? So as long as the OP keeps the water feature nice and clean, it's probably fine, at least as clean as ponds and puddles that wild corn snakes would drink from.

 

[psychoprimate84]

Yeah I love the water feature too and I am sure the filtration keeps it clean, just like a fish tank (which, of course, the fish poo in). Hopper/weanling mice would be perfect for your snake. Once it gets switched to frozen/thawed, slashing the back of the mice would be a good way to get your snake digesting the meal thoroughly as well.

 

[coralife205]

hahaha im glad im not the only one here that lieks the water idea! lol i saw it on youtube once! i dont even jknwo what mites are or look like....but i doubt my snake has them..

 

[Jessicat]

I can tell if a snake is fat. My point/question was that I've yet to see a fat juvie, and am curious if it can even be "done." And if so, what are the circumstances?

A little thing called Power Feeding...

Don't try this at home, kids! :twohammer
http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63161&highlight=power+feeding


Hey, kinda :-offtopic , but judging from this picture, I'd say your snake is actually male.

 

[coralife205]

the vet probed it back in january. they said it was a female because they could get the probe in deep. i had another corn snake at the time, and they couldnt get the probe that far in at all, and it turnd out to be a male.

 

[SnakeAround]

the vet probed it back in january. they said it was a female because they could get the probe in deep. i had another corn snake at the time, and they couldnt get the probe that far in at all, and it turnd out to be a male.

Either that's a typo or they mixed up the rule with probing: males probe deep, females don't.

Probing a male as a female can happen if the males has strong muscles or you can't probe very well.

 

[coralife205]

ahhh yea its a typo...at least i think...damn it ! id ont remember anymore which snake was probed deep! lol. I remember them saying though, that this one was a female. they were certain. it was a vet that did it....

 

[Sweetseraph]

Umm, don't jump on the OP for the cool water feature in the vivarium.

I don't think I jumped on them. I think I expressed some concerns.

If the snake doesn't have mites, isn't getting scale rot and so on, why not?

i dont even jknwo what mites are or look like....but i doubt my snake has them..

:sidestep: (I think it's safe to assume the same is true of scale rot?)

So as long as the OP keeps the water feature nice and clean, it's probably fine, at least as clean as ponds and puddles that wild corn snakes would drink from.

So by the same token, why do we all bother buying "clean" domestic mice, instead of just catching us some wild ones? I think we all try to keep our corns under cleaner conditions than they would experience in the wild. Like I said, when I saw the water feature, my first thought was about how to clean it. I think most keepers like to remove the water dish and wash and disinfect it on a regular basis, which obviously is impossible with the water feature, short of when the whole tank gets dumped and cleaned. It might be fine and the OP and everyone else is free to do as they wish with their corns; I was just expressing some concerns.

And how many of us who have more than 1 or 2 corns change water every day?

It's not necessary to change the snake's water every day anyways.

Well, at least we agree on one thing...

 

[coralife205]

i have alot of expereince cleaning water... i have a 150 gallon reef tank. I know how to clean water...trust me

 

[VickyChaiTea]

I really don't think the water feature is an issue if it's kept clean. Doing 100% water changes/scrubbing it down should be enough to keep it from getting gross.

 

[Lolo]

If you care about your snake, you should be feeding it frozen/thawed mice, but that's another issue.

I'm sorry, but what is that supposed to mean? Many many keepers (myself included) feed live, and care plenty about our snakes... that is what they eat in the wild, ya know. Not to hijack the thread, but I'm getting a little sick of the f/t Gestapo on this forum. Maybe my perspective is different, since I'm more of a python keeper - but really people, it's fine to feed live if you're responsibly supervising.

FYI: My corns mostly take f/t, but I have one who only eats live, and most of my BPs are live-only as well. Are you saying I don't care about my snakes? Would it be more responsible to let them starve??

 

[bitsy]

Sorry if you feel put-upon, but we quite often get people here asking for advice on how to treat mouse bites to their Corns. Even if you stand over them, you won't be quick enough to prevent a bite.

If you have one that flatly refuses to eat anything but live, then of course that's what you have to do and nobody is saying otherwise. We find a lot of people feeding live because that's what they've been advised to do - we just advise against it unless absolutely necessary (as in your case) because we see the consequences. Just part of the skewed perspective you get from a message board I guess. Few people come here to announce that a routine feeding has gone well but a lot come to ask for advice after a problem has happened.

In the wild, it's a bit of a different matter. A snake will rarely find itself trapped in an enclosed space with a mouse that it may not feel like eating immediately. In the wild, a snake will usually hunt its prey down with the sole intention of eating it, then kill and eat it immediately. In captivity, the snake isn't necessarily going to eat the mouse immediately because we can't accurately tell when they're ready to eat. The mouse may have time to get spooked and act defensively and the snake has nowhere to get away to. Some folks don't realise that it's dangerous to leave a "disinterested" snake and a live mouse together, unsupervised. We've had the occasional person who thinks leaving them together overnight is risk-free.