"Original" Granites

[Susan]

If those that snakes are stripes, they aren't very clean stripes IMO. They look more like striped motley Keys with a vanishing pattern. They are very interesting, but I see nothing I would even consider "granite" about them. If the breeder continues using that trade name, I would personally consider it a very poor choice. But then, I also consider "ashy" and "cinder" as poor choices for that morph as well. :shrugs:

 

[toyah]

Whatever they are, they're very attractive animals.

 

[cka]

Definitely a neat looking appearance, I like it :*)

The name issue...Ehhh...his snakes, he's entitled to call them what he wants lol...no dog in that hunt tho...Someone correct if wrong, do the upper keys have a patternless ventral?...Upper keys are just a "locality" corn, aren't they?...wouldn't be a stretch to say motley, or striped, or something completely new was introduced (developed, mutated etc) into this population before its "separation" from the mainland population...Do they ever make it off the Keys and into the mainland population, or vice versa; do mainland corns ever get over on the Keys?...s

Sorry bit of a Sunday ramble...looking forward to seeing this and KJ's Silverleaf Kisatchies progression :*)

 

[TandJ]

cka was asking about the following....

Someone correct if wrong, do the upper keys have a patternless ventral?...Upper keys are just a "locality" corn, aren't they?...

Upper Keys vent patterns often have the line through the belly, faded and off to the edges .. Upper Keys were considered to be their own animal until a few years back.. IMHO, they should have been left in their own family..


Regards.. Tim of T and J

 

[Roy Munson]

Definitely a neat looking appearance, I like it :*)

The name issue...Ehhh...his snakes, he's entitled to call them what he wants lol...no dog in that hunt tho...Someone correct if wrong, do the upper keys have a patternless ventral?...Upper keys are just a "locality" corn, aren't they?...wouldn't be a stretch to say motley, or striped, or something completely new was introduced (developed, mutated etc) into this population before its "separation" from the mainland population...Do they ever make it off the Keys and into the mainland population, or vice versa; do mainland corns ever get over on the Keys?...s

Sorry bit of a Sunday ramble...looking forward to seeing this and KJ's Silverleaf Kisatchies progression :*)

From my observations, there seem to be at least two "strains" of Keys corns out there, and I'm sure there are many more. In my mind, I separate these strains by breeder, but the labeling is admittedly b.s.; it's just how I think of them. "Zuchowski" Keys corns, from which the cinders are derived, have reduced, but not absent ventral checkering. The non-checkered portion of the belly has a rosy-ish cast. "Soderberg" Keys corns have no belly checkers, and the belly is yellowish. To me, the "Zuchowski" Keys corns look 100% corn in all ways, and the "Soderberg" Keys corns are a little different in coloration and even head/eye shape. It wouldn't shock me to find that the "Soderberg" Keys corns had some other rat snake in their heritage, way back. This is only how I'm observing things, and in no way implies that my suspicions are valid. I actually prefer what I'm calling the "Soderberg" look over the "Zuchowski" look. I have multiple examples of both types in my collection. Search for "Zod" or "Zelda" to see the "Z" strain, and "Earn" or "Claudia" to see the "S" strain...

Since corns have made it to Caribbean islands hitchhiking in cargo, etc., I don't think it would be absurd to entertain the idea that there may be some genetic exchange between corns living in the Keys and those living on the mainland. But other genes (e.g., aneryA) have been found in geographically distant populatons where genetic exchange isn't likely, so who knows how far back in corn history some of the color/pattern mutations appeared?

 

[tom e]

Because Jeff told me he hasn't paired it with Stripe and doesn't plan on it. I believe I said that on one of my posts.

That's a very odd decision. :shrugs: I would definately say it's not worth the price now. Paying that for these animals would be crazier than paying the same price for a possible het. I guess it doesn't change his right to use the name, but it makes me feel a little funny about defending it to be honest.