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"Original" Granites

TripleMoonsExotic

I <3 Stripes!
Anyone else see this?
http://market.kingsnake.com/detail.php?cat=65&de=528381

I've attached screenshots as well for when the ad is gone.

They're certainly interesting, but worth the price tag? Is there a reason why they are being called Granites (outside that Jeff is stubborn ;) ) when that name is already established? I've never seen or heard of them before. :shrugs:
 

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I like those whatever they are.. Anyone familiar with their genetics? (As for the price, lots of stuff is out of my range, so that doesn't even phase me any more..)
Oh, just followed his reference to Kathy's book, "A new patternless/ striped variant of the rosy rat from the Florida Keys..."
As for his calling them Granites, I probably wouldn't for the confusion, but I guess they were first, so I'd say he's entitled..
 
Hmmm...interesting...

I think the name "Granite" is more accurate for the Anery A bloods personally, colour-wise...

Still that is interesting and pretty!
 
They remind me of a fugly Stripe. :grin01: I have a fugly Stripe female that actually reminds me of them. Wonder what they're supposed to look like as adults.
 
They are unusual certainly...but they are not what I would call "pretty" as such. lol

I wonder what they are...I know they have "rosy rat" blood but what else? lol
 
The page on Kathy's book that he refers to has a picture of an adult.. It looks even better IMO..
 
The question really boils down to which came first and what do people like? I personally am used to granites being the anery diffused (bloodred) and not this new whatever. The high price suggests that this is pretty new and I might have chosen a different name based on the fact that granite was already being used. It'll be interesting if this name catches on and we have two different granites.

~Katie
 
I'm a huge fan of Upper Keys/Rosy Rat snakes, and these are very cool. The adult on page 192 of Kathy's newer guide is awesome. If this look is caused by a single non-motley or non-stripe gene, then I think the price is justified. But is this proven? They sure look like pure Keys snakes, so even if they're the result of mot and/or stripe popping up in pure Keys lines (not outcrossed to a non-Keys and recovered), they'd be worth a lot of money too, but I don't know about $1800 per pair. But if they're really just Keys lines that have had motley or stripe introduced into them from non-Keys sources, then I definitely think they're vastly overpriced. I'd need to know a lot more before I even considered buying any.

But I just bought another cinder (a Keys derivative too), and I bought a pair of kick-butt Keys Bloods a few months ago, so unless these snakes crap gold, I won't be buying them anyway.
 
Velvet said:
Hmmm...interesting...

I think the name "Granite" is more accurate for the Anery A bloods personally, colour-wise...

Still that is interesting and pretty!

I agree that what is more commonly called granite looks more like granite to me..
But then I looked up some pictures of actual granite..

http://www.graniteforyourhome.com/html/Granite_Stone.html

But we've had this conversation again and again right? People call their stuff whatever they want to call it. At the end of the day the confusion will only really cause problems for the lesser known morph, so if the breeder wants to take the risk cause he thinks he's got something with that package, what's the problem?
 
Roy Munson said:
But I just bought another cinder (a Keys derivative too), and I bought a pair of kick-butt Keys Bloods a few months ago, so unless these snakes crap gold, I won't be buying them anyway.
Are Keys Bloods what I've heard referred to as Rosy Bloods?

:-offtopic If you do get any gold crap, screw breeding them, sell their poop!:grin01:
 
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dwyn127 said:
Are Keys Bloods what I've heard referred to as Rosy Bloods?

:-offtopic I've you do get any gold crap, screw breeding them, sell their poop!:grin01:

Yes they are.. And Dean's got pictures of a great specimen on here somewhere..

I'd personally sell a gold pooping snake. For a million. Having a gold making machine that could die is too much of a liability. :grin01:
 
dwyn127 said:
Are Keys Bloods what I've heard referred to as Rosy Bloods?
Yep. I've always avoided using the term "Rosy" for Upper Keys corns because there are still some people who associate the word with HypoA. I'm not one of them, but I also keep rosy boas, so...

:-offtopic I've you do get any gold crap, screw breeding them, sell their poop!:grin01:
:laugh: Yeah, but wouldn't you want to breed yourself a COLONY of gold-pooping corns?
 
Does that mean we're looking for some "Au S**t" hets? Because I've already got some of those. ;)

regards,
jazz
 
jazzgeek said:
Does that mean we're looking for some "Au S**t" hets? Because I've already got some of those. ;)
:laugh: Pu, that joke stinks so bad, it's radioactive. Reminds me of the guy who asked if I was Bi. I told him it was none of his... :grin01:
 
Roy Munson said:
:laugh: Pu, that joke stinks so bad, it's radioactive. Reminds me of the guy who asked if I was Bi. I told him it was none of his... :grin01:
Johnny was a chemist
but Johnny ain't no more
what Johnny thought was H2O
was H2SO4.

Ions outta here!! You radicals have been a great crowd!
icon_bolt.gif


regards,
jazz
 
I don't see "granite" when I look at that animal. Interesting, though. The color/pattern reminds me of whitewater locality rosy boas.

Chris
 
Granite . . .

Actually, the key's animals in question were named GRANITE by Craig Boyd around 10 years ago, when we were still calling anery bloods ANERY BLOODS. When the anery bloods were named RAIDER corns, it was disputed and a vote was taken on this forum to change that name. One of the options for the new name was GRANITE. Around that time, I pointed out that the name was already being used for the key's corn morph. It was decided by someone at that time to ignore this information and reassign GRANITE to the anery bloods. Just a few months later, Kathy's book came out with the picture of the key's animal, the granite corn.

In every situation that I'm aware, the first person to assign the name of anything, lays claim to that name. Resolution of this debate may well boil down to the question, "who published first?" and/or what is the definition of publish?. I personally first saw one of the key's granites in person at the first Daytona expo (was that 1999?). Guss Rentfro and Craig Boyd had an adult specimen on display there, and the following week, they shipped me a trio of neonates.

In my next book, a picture not unlike the one Kathy published will be called GRANITE. It would be sad if there were two entirely different snakes with the same name, so I hope this is resolved by then. I think it's only fair to comply with common sense and let the first name assignment stand. If only Kathy had known the CS forum members were reassigning an established morph name to a different snake just months before her book showed the name was already in use. Surely anery bloods would have a different name today and we wouldn't be in this mess. I recall at the time saying that both Stephen Fowler and Brian Barczyk (BHB Enterprises) were breeding this key's variety, but had not yet listed them on their web sites. If someone finds that thread, I recall someone making a statement to the effect, "if we're unaware of that morph on this forum, the previous user of this name will have to change the name of their's ". Shoulddah used paraphrase markers instead of quotes on that. I don't recall the exact language used at that time.

At this time, the keys' animals are taxonomically classified as pure corn snakes. From speaking to the originator of this morph (Craig Boyd), the original breeders were wild caught on one of the keys. As someone previously pointed out, color and pattern mutations are not uncommon in any given population of corn. IE: cinders and rosy bloods, to name just two morphs of the keys' race. It is my observation from seeing about 12 of these key corns that we're dealing with the striped pattern here; specifically one that has the vanishing effect.

Don Soderberg
South Mountain Reptiles
 
SODERBERGD said:
In every situation that I'm aware, the first person to assign the name of anything, lays claim to that name.

I think that's proven multiple times that isn't true. ;) A trade name will only stick if it's used by the masses (as it has for Granites).

Thanks for the history though, very cool.
Do you happen to have a picture of an adult that you could post? I'm curious what one looks like.
 
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