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Purist Breeders

I feel like a broken record as I am not stating anything I have not stated before, but apparently many pick and choose what they choose to remember. And fyi, a good hybridizer frequently doesn't tell what they are working with. The reason being is that they don't want someone else beating them to the punch. Now, it goes without saying that if you have the only one of something that you can brag if you wish as how can someone beat you to the punch if your already ahead? That is not the case with me however, as I have said time and time again, I'm in the research phase. I am trying to learn before I leap. Eventually, I must leap head first however as I do not intend to stand on the side lines much longer and it is clear that there will be much that I will continue to learn and have to learn by hands on experience just as many others have done before me.
 
Nanci said:
I'm not into hybrids, unless they are stunningly beautiful. Like a jungle corn- meh. Once you start doing milksnake crosses, I get interested, but rather than try to create my own, I'd rather just spend the money and get a work of art from someone else. If I wanted to own one in the first place.
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I can totally understand that sentiment Nanci. It is much easier to simply buy someone else's art work than to hope and try to create ones own art. It is also often times easier to buy someone else's artwork and work from that rather than go through the many years to catch up to them recreating their masterpiece. In the mean time, they are light years ahead of you going off in two different directions or perhaps three. Sadly, by recreating the wheel, you are in no position to play catch up at this time.:bowdown:
 
bitsy said:
This is a shared perception.
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And yet, people continue to misrepresent what I have said over and over and over....

My favorite assumption that I have seen some make is that you must have a snake collection, hybrid snakes, etc. to know anything about hybridizing or snakes for that matter. There is much you can learn from hybridizing other species, reading, etc. To infer that someone knows more simply because they were able to purchase 1000 snakes yesterday does not mean they know more than a fellow who has owned 1 snake for 10 years or even a fellow who has never owned a snake, but studied snakes. Its illogical to say the least where some of these arguments and assumptions have been going.

Just like saying it the fault of hybridizers that purists can not keep track of the lineage of their pure snakes is illogical. Its very simple to keep track of the lineage of a snake. Fine one in the wild. Breed it to another snake found in the wild. Then, keep records from that day forward of all breedings. If you do so you will know the parentage of your lineage. If you then ask for the same from any outside source..... you have a complete record of your snakes all the way back to the wild. However, once you introduce a snake of unknown lineage.... that is your fault for introducing uncertainty into your line and no one else is to blame for that fault.
 
When a picture is posted by someone, it is assumed that the snake belongs to that person. When someone posts (steals) another person's picture, they need to credit the owner, or at least state where they got that picture from.

Posting other people's pictures and not crediting them is lowdown and pretty frowned upon.
 
So is your intention to take wild-caught snakes and start from there with your hybridisation?
(I'm so tempted to ask if a hawk will be involved too, but I won't)
 
I think the broken record perception comes from you jumping into threads and repeating yourself. Or posting a new thread and saying the same thing. Unless it was the chicken vs duck thread; that one was refreshing and we got to hear your views on other things too. :)
 
starsevol said:
When a picture is posted by someone, it is assumed that the snake belongs to that person. When someone posts (steals) another person's picture, they need to credit the owner, or at least state where they got that picture from.

Posting other people's pictures and not crediting them is lowdown and pretty frowned upon.
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You know what they say when you assume things?
You make an ... out of you and me.

But, if you don't where to actually examine my albums where I have these photos listed, you would see that many have things like.... UK hybrids stamped on them, mosaic reptiles stamped on them, etc. I would seriously be surprised if anyone thought I owned such snakes.... as I would take my own photos if that were the case and post them.... or would that make too much sense?
 
DragonsDenSerpents said:
I think the broken record perception comes from you jumping into threads and repeating yourself. Or posting a new thread and saying the same thing. Unless it was the chicken vs duck thread; that one was refreshing and we got to hear your views on other things too. :)
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Perhaps I wouldn't have to repeat myself if my words were not always taken out of context or false assumptions made? Perhaps, if one paid attention one would realize I have stated over and over I had no snakes. I am merely researching? Perhaps then, one would not jump to such assumptions that I had a plethora of hybrids waiting to infiltrate your beautiful collections. Perhaps, if one were to use logic one would understand my future hybrids I hope to create could not enter your collections nor could anyone else's hybrids enter any purist collections if purists merely accounted for the lineage of all of the snakes in their collection. Blaming the hybridizer is sad and a powerless position to take. Take back your power. Own the fact that if you can't account for the lineage of all your snakes this is your own failing if purity is of the utmost importance. Stop attacking the person who is taking the time to research before they leap. I would think that such research would be applauded, and yet I find just the opposite. Dmong, has given me several ideas of what to hybridize though and for that I thank him as I intend to try my hand at hybrids that have not been attempted to my knowledge when I begin and yes... some that have already been attempted.
 
Perhaps, if Dave P. had read the message I sent him telling him that he was mistaken.... that it was not my snake... but his... he would understand that I was not trying to deceive him or anyone else?
 
This is exactly what I wrote, "Your memory is not slipping, I was not able to purchase that one from you at the time. It was one of many beautiful babies that got away. Its sad, but I can't have everything I want at the moment I want it. Just keep me posted with a potential clutch date in advance if you can. I just bought my wife some sun conures so shes going to owe me. Shes driving down to Florida on friday to pick them up. 01-23-2013, 09:02 AM" So, if some many days later there is still confusion as to what I meant to do.... this is a very sad state of affairs indeed.
 
So what were the great hybrid ideas I inspired you with?

I wouldn't think it would take too much to "inspire" you to make hybrids if you dream about making them in your sleep as you've mentioned here before :roflmao:


~Doug
 
Yes, I admire Dave's work. I would have loved to get my hands on some of his hybrids.... but I do have a code of ethics that I go by. Number one in that code of ethics is honesty. If you can't be honest I have no need to deal with you.

Number 2 in my code of ethics. Loyalty, if I use another hybridizers snakes to help create something I will honor whether they wish to be publicly acknowledged as the giants shoulders I am attempting to stand on or I will keep it private at that hybridizers discretion.

Number 3 in my code of ethics. Honor, I will try to show proper respect and honor to those that have helped me in an honorable way and return the favor of 1st or 2nd pick of babies from pairs of exceptional hybrids that I am allowed to purchase to further my efforts if any are suitable to their own program as it could very well be that they don't like where I am going with my hybrids or I may fail miserably.... I have many other ethics that I go by, not the least of which is to take full responsibility for what I create and realize that if lineages are not supplied in full, that I am responsible for taking the risk associated with not knowing such lineages. I will not whine that someone tried to trick me or has polluted my hybrid gene pool with unknown variables if such was not done intentionally or with malice.
 
DMong said:
So what were the great hybrid ideas I inspired you with?

I wouldn't think it would take too much to "inspire" you to make hybrids if you dream about making them in your sleep as you've mentioned here before :roflmao:


~Doug
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No Dmong, I don't believe in sharing all of my ideas, but you will be given full credit if and when I do use your ideas in as much as you deserve credit. As I don't want to be blamed for not giving proper credit where proper credit is due.:blowup:
 
Carpe Serpentis said:
I will not whine that someone tried to trick me or has polluted my hybrid gene pool with unknown variables if such was not done intentionally or with malice.
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Yeah, heaven forbid your hybrid project ever gets "polluted".

The two words "hybrid" and "polluted" are already synonymous with one another and completely interchangeable in my opinion?
 
DMong said:
Yeah, heaven forbid your hybrid project ever gets "polluted".

The two words "hybrid" and "polluted" are already synonymous with one another and completely interchangeable in my opinion?
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I see pollution as unaccounted for and unwanted influence as well as loss of knowledge of lineage. With a pure snake, I see that as any line where the lineage is not fully known back to the wild. As a hybridizer, I settle for many unknowns with the hope of creating something beautiful as purity is not something I truly believe in. I welcome wild cards as they are something to look for an decide on whether to keep them, eliminate them, or improve upon them.
 
Carpe Serpentis said:
No Dmong, I don't believe in sharing all of my ideas, but you will be given full credit if and when I do use your ideas in as much as you deserve credit. As I don't want to be blamed for not giving proper credit where proper credit is due.:blowup:
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I would strongly suggest that you tread very carefully with this future fantasy of yours.
 
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