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This is a new one for me...

tyflier

tyflier

[Insert Witty Commentary]
Alright, here's the situation... In case you don't know, I work at a wildlife rehab center. Long story short, a member of the local herpetology club brings me a gophersnake that he found on the side of the road.

The snake had been hit, presumably, but was alive. Severely dehydrated, belly full of rodent, and showing signs of moderate head trauma. He also showed signs of either a dislocated or broken jaw.

In the course of the exam, I noticed something sticking out of his mouth. It was his tongue. It was dried out and stiff. First order was to hydrate, so I slowly hydrated him orally. I looked at the jaw closely as he drank, and the displacement I noticed earlier sorted itself with a little swelling but no displacement. I gave him a course of Symphytum orally throughout the day, and he actually has recovered quite well with a noticeable decrease in swelling, and a noticeable increase in activity. (Symphytum is a homeopathic treatment for fractures, and eye/head trauma.)

His tongue is still dried out and sticking out of his mouth more than 24 hours later. My question is...will this heal with continued hydration? If not, can this snake survive without a tongue? I have no problem keeping this snake in captivity if he loses the tongue and cannot hunt. I don't mind providing food for him. However, I don't want to continue treating him if he has very little chance of survival after treatment. I don't want to force a painful life on a doomed snake.

Anyhow...I've looked through every book, website, and manual I have access to, and believe me that is quite a bit, and I can't find an answer to my question. So I figure one of you folks might have an answer for me...

Thanks!
 
From what I have heard, a snake can loose it's tongue and still do well in captivity. I don't think that without a tongue the snake would survive in the wild, as that is it's main way to find food. If the blood supply to the tongue was cut off then I assume it will die and fall off, but if it is a matter of just being dry it should perk back up in a few days.
 
I think I recall a thread on here of a hatchling that got its tongue stuck in/on the hole of a deli cup, and it dried up and fell off. I can't remember what happened to that snake, but I do recall that in that thread, another person mentioned that the same thing happened to them, more or less. I'm thinking both snakes lived, but I can't recall for sure and I really can't recall any other information about that thread.

I'm pretty practical and I definitely understand your concern, but I say give him a chance without the tongue. If after some healing he'll eat without it, make him your pet. Good luck!
 
I really have no idea. But I don't see why not. I don't think they use the tongue while eating or drinking. I agree to give him a chance if he overcomes his other injuries.
 
here's the thread.
This particular one died though.
I do agree that your's still might do well in captivity, though it's a hard call to make. I'd say keep it till it's completely healed, and then observe how it acts. Maybe you can see signs of distress, or (preferebly) a snake completely at ease.
 
Have you tried something like KY jelly on the tngue? We use it at work when people have really dried out sore tongues, swabbing it to help rehydrate the mucous membranes.
 
Jeff Mohr's snake died; I don't think we ever got an update on Jorge's snake. I think all you can do is see if you can save the tongue or not, and then after it falls off, see if he will still eat.
 
Seems like both Jeff and Jorge had snakes that died shortly after losing the tongue. There are a couple of differences, though, that give me hope.

Primarily, both cases happened to very young hatchling cornsnakes. This is a 210gram, sub-adult gophersnake.

Both also happened as a result of getting "stuck", which gives me the impression that the snakes put some sort of effort into getting unstuck, possibly damaging musculature in the process. This snake's tongue was not stuck to a foreign body or container, and likely was not pulled on in an attempt to get free.

At least one of the previous snakes was a trouble feeder to begin with. This guy came in with a fairly large, recent meal. He did regurgitate the meal in his belly, but that was expected, and regurge protocol will be followed.

I'm going in in a couple minutes, and I will be there all day, working with his hydration levels and comfort. I have hope, and desire. This is the first snake ever admitted to ESWC, because I am the first intern to have a strong background in snakes. They simply didn't know how to treat snake injuries in the past, so they never really tried. This is my "baby", and while I certainly hope above all that he will pull through, even if he becomes a captive snake, I am a realist. If it becomes apparent that he cannot maintain a quality life after his ordeal, he will be humanely euthanized. Until that point, he and I will continue to work together to try and get him recovered.

Thanks for the input, everyone!
 
Good luck with him! And keep us updated. I'm curious how wether he's going to make it fine without his tongue or not.
 
tyflier said:
Alright, here's the situation... In case you don't know, I work at a wildlife rehab center. Long story short, a member of the local herpetology club brings me a gophersnake that he found on the side of the road.

The snake had been hit, presumably, but was alive. Severely dehydrated, belly full of rodent, and showing signs of moderate head trauma. He also showed signs of either a dislocated or broken jaw.

In the course of the exam, I noticed something sticking out of his mouth. It was his tongue. It was dried out and stiff. First order was to hydrate, so I slowly hydrated him orally. I looked at the jaw closely as he drank, and the displacement I noticed earlier sorted itself with a little swelling but no displacement. I gave him a course of Symphytum orally throughout the day, and he actually has recovered quite well with a noticeable decrease in swelling, and a noticeable increase in activity. (Symphytum is a homeopathic treatment for fractures, and eye/head trauma.)

His tongue is still dried out and sticking out of his mouth more than 24 hours later. My question is...will this heal with continued hydration? If not, can this snake survive without a tongue? I have no problem keeping this snake in captivity if he loses the tongue and cannot hunt. I don't mind providing food for him. However, I don't want to continue treating him if he has very little chance of survival after treatment. I don't want to force a painful life on a doomed snake.

Anyhow...I've looked through every book, website, and manual I have access to, and believe me that is quite a bit, and I can't find an answer to my question. So I figure one of you folks might have an answer for me...

Thanks!
Click to expand...

In captivity I know they can survive, I had a friend in Pa. that had an albino WDB that was born without a tongue and he lived fine, the snake did have problems with coordination but I think that was from something else. Good luck with the snake.
 
I once had a Honduran milk hatch without a tongue (as far as I could tell). I never even noticed until he was a couple of months old that he NEVER used his tongue. I was never able to elicit a tongue flick no matter what, so concluded he didn't have one. But he did just fine.

Based on my experience with dried out hemipenes, I would guess that once it is too dried out, the tissue is dead and can't be revived. But if he hasn't endured too much trauma to important organs, I would guess that he could survive in captivity without a tongue, though probably not in the wild.

Good Luck!
 
Captivity is what I projected for him. I knew he wouldn't be able to hunt effectively without a tongue, and it has already fallen off as of this afternoon. So he will go home with one of us from the center. Hopefully he will recover fully, minus the tongue, and be a decent candidate for schools and demonstrations. At least I hope that he heals and recovers well enough to get fat and lazy in retirement for a few years.

He still has some signs of head trauma, but he is definitely improving. He was quite active today, comparatively speaking. Really that just means he moved around the small, minimalist enclosure I have him in. Yesterday, I touched him several times, just to make sure he wasn't dead. Every time I touched him, he responded with strong body rolls, but other than that, he just laid there. Without the constant tongue flicks...I got nervous a few times. Today he roamed a little bit, drank water on his own, and responded well to stimulation.

Thanks again, everyone, for all the input. Rest assured that myself, and the other workers at the center are willing to work with him, as long as he is capable of recovering. We give every animal a fair chance, and most get more than that. We've made miracles happen when other centers would have euthanized immediately, so we won't give up without trying everything we can.

If things go well, I will be posting pictures of a healthy, albeit tongueless, Great Basin Gophersnake within a couple weeks...
 
I feel confident, Chris, that you will make the best decision for his welfare, no matter which way it goes. Good luck, snake.
 
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I, too, think captivity may work for him. I have heard of others who have had snakes missing a tongue and they were fine. My hatchling did die but I think there were many factors involved such as its young age and as you mentioned, the fact it lost its tongue in a very unfortunate way.
 
WingedSweetheart said:
Any updates? I'm curious as to how he's doing.
Click to expand...
He's doing well. He is exploring his tiny recovery cage, drinking water on his own, and healing well. He isn't showing any signs of residual brain damage from the head trauma, though it does appear he will be permanently blind in one eye, as well as having no tongue.

The big test will be his first feeding. He regurged shortly after coming to the center, so I need to wait a while before attemtping to feed. He also had a broken jaw, so I need to allow that to heal before I can attempt feeding. Truthfully, that will be the tell-tale sign. If he eats well...he'll be fine. If not...I'll have to cross that bridge when we get there...
 
As an interesting aside...I never realized how much I relied on their tongue flicks to indicate their moods, wants, and attitude. Having a snake with no tongue is proving to be very interesting inasmuch as observing the animal's otherwise "normal" routine. They really give me a lot more information about themselves with tongue flicks than I was aware of until now...
 
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