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Your Religious Views

Are you...

  • Theist (Religious)

    Votes: 73 43.2%
  • Agnostic (Unsure)

    Votes: 29 17.2%
  • Atheist (Not religious)

    Votes: 67 39.6%

  • Total voters
    169

Paradox

Insane reptiphile
Although I can see this spiralling out of control, I'm willing to give anything a try - PLEASE keep to stating your views and friendly and calm arguing of your point - a good cheery argument can be good for you, infact I love a good debate...just please, do your best not to provoke...I don't want a huge fight on my hands. :twoguns:


So, are you religious, or are you not? If you are, why do you believe in your faith? If not, similarly, why not? I find this an interesting topic personally...


As for me, I'm with science all the way, and am by far the strongest atheist of anyone I know (Most people I know are agnostic). I tend to keep my views to myself though unless provoked to voice my opinion. I know basicly every argument against religion that there is. Please, don't think that I hate it or don't respect your views, I do - I've tried the whole following God thing. But I could never accept it, it just seems totally illogical to me...oh, and to any of you looking to convert me, good luck...lots of people have tried, including a girlfriend who's convinced herself I'll go to hell for not believing...frankly though if this God character condemns you to hell for not being a sheep and thinking differently to other humans, for having your own views (Which appears to be what's stated, though correct me if I'm wrong), then I don't see why he deserves praise...


Still, your views. Feel free to ask any questions you have as well. :) And don't let my age put you off, I do the whole debating thing all over the place...I enjoy a good argument. Although it can be aggravating at times...humans are so stubborn. :grin01:
 
Not a great start, that sounds a whole lot more hostile now than it did when I wrote it. It wasn't meant to come across that way, really. :grin01:
 
TBH I'm totally not religious.

EDIT: removed the other bit of this post, I guess the top bit answers the question.

-George-
 
I don't know what I'm going to say here. I voted theist. I was raised in a pretty religious family- my dad and his brothers were the first generation in forever that didn't produce a minister. I was raised Episcopalian. My grandfather was a minister. I've always "believed in" evolution, though- how could you not? I mean, the evidence is there. I had a hard time reconciling the two things though- if there had been dinosaurs, how could God have created the earth in seven days, and if that was not so, was the entire bible like a story book? When I asked this question in confirmation class- maybe age ten, the teacher told me, what if there was a different time scale? What if the dinosaurs thing really happened, and maybe that time frame of millions of years from the earth forming, and life beginning, took place in a matter of hours or days, in biblical time? Whatever, it was enough to allow me the dignity of not totally renouncing my religious upbringing. I proudly claimed to be agnostic for much of my teenage years- heck, I just didn't know. Was there a God, wasn't there?

But I came to realize, in my 20's, that proof doesn't matter. Faith is what we that believe in God have. I didn't go out looking for it- it came to me. I haven't seriously asked God for many things in my life. Maybe three. The first thing was this. I had a baby pigeon- given to me by my daughter for Mother's Day. But he had something wrong with his feet. I didn't know so much about pigeons then as I do now- it was caused by improper support in the nest. All I knew was his feet were curled weird, deformed, and he couldn't stand on them, and even though I made little braces out of cardboard and taped his feet to them, it just wasn't working. I was desperate- I wanted that bird to be normal, not a cripple. So I prayed to God, like cashed in all my chips. I said, 'God, I have never asked you for anything ever before. I haven't frivolously been asking for everything. This is the one thing I want the most of anything- is for my bird to be fixed. What I offer in exchange is this- I will treat every drunk, icky, homeless, mean, patient that I get from now on for the rest of my career as if they were my father or mother, with as much respect and caring as is in me to give." (I worked at a big inner city county hospital, and it was easy to get burned out, to not take the time to listen, to start feeling like people didn't care for themselves, so why should I (beyond what was ethically required) care for them...) I woke up in the morning- we were on a camping trip, and Dill's toes were straight. I swear, it was a miracle. He was strong, and his feet were good, and he began standing on them that day.

I did pray for another thing- like make a bargain, ask for something, and I got what I asked for, immediately, well, the next day, and as things turned out, it was a case of "well, you asked for it!" And shouldn't have. Learned my lesson there.

When my dad died, I'll never forget the eulogy. The minister spoke of my father, who'd been an engineer, to whom every mystery was a code to be broken, who researched everything, who was curious about life, mechanical things, theological things, and he said, imagine the excitement my father is feeling right now- he is unraveling the mystery of life after death- what could be more exciting for him than that? I took a lot of comfort in those words. It pleased me to think of my father being happy in death, with many untold things yet to discover.

I don't know how I feel about life after death. There's no proof. I just finished reading an excellent book by Mary Roach called "Spook: Science Tackles The Afterlife" in which she asks "What happens when we die? Does the light just go out and that's that-the million-year nap? Or will some part of my personality, my me-ness, persist? What will that feel like? What will I do all day? Is there a place to plug in my laptop?" In an attempt to find out, Mary Roach brings her tireless curiosity to bear on an array of contemporary and historical soul-searchers: scientists, schmers, engineers, mediums, all trying to prove (or disprove) that life goes on after we die.

I read this book once, "Lovely Bones," a fiction book about a girl who is murdered, who looks down from heaven and watches the goings-on after her death. How her family reacts. How the murderer is caught. I like the feeling of how heaven is imagined in that book- it's kind of like heaven is how you, yourself, imagine it to be, and for every person it's different, and it changes as you accept your death and move on.

I don't think God is a micro-manager. I don't think he controls everything that happens. I think we are left to make good decisions or bad, or even evil ones, and face the consequences. You often hear people say, how can there be a God if he would allow this (just pick any small or large horrifying event) to happen? I don't know the answer to that. I think we for the most part are left to fend for ourselves. But I firmly believe that God is up there keeping track- that every good and bad thing we do gets tallied. This has particularly affected me in my actions toward animals. I stop and help. I spend what I have to rescue an animal who someone else might throw back in the woods. I'll stop to pick up a bird who is going to die, and make sure it isn't smashed any more, and dies as peaceful a death as there is, and give it a quiet grave. I'll take a baby hawk to a rehabber. I'll take a nest of baby flycatchers, feed them hourly, wait for the rehabber to take them. I'll pick a drowning wasp out of a dish of water. I'll swerve and slam on my brakes and honk at crows to get them to fly away, and stop to let ducks cross the road, and give a turtle a quick trip across to the other side. Compassion for people is more difficult- I feel like, if you can't help yourself- why should I help you? But I try. I do the best I can.

I talk to God every night before I go to sleep. A lot of it is saying thank you. Or asking God to watch out for someone. Or saying, dear mom and dad, if you can hear me, up in heaven- and so on. It's comforting to me.

That's just some of my thoughts.

Nanci
 
Last edited:
Pet Corn Snake said:
EDIT: removed the other bit of this post, I guess the top bit answers the question.

-George-

George- You're a contributing member!! When did that happen? I'm proud of you! Are you revelling in your editing capabilities?

Nanci
 
Good post Nanci. I am religious, I go to a catholic school and go to church most weekends.

:-offtopic Yea, I also noticed George became an contributing member. Good job!
 
Paradox said:
So, are you religious, or are you not? If you are, why do you believe in your faith? If not, similarly, why not?

I'm an atheist. All religions began in much the same manner: man, attempting to understand the world around him, imagined explanations based upon the facts as he knew them. When the facts had yet to be discovered, man resorted to belief in supernatural forces. It is easier for man to accept the supernatural than to accept that he hasn't the capacity to understand the natural explanation. "God did it" requires no effort to find out more, to dig deeper. The rest is but custom, rules that worked well enough for their time but that make little sense in modern society, yet they are used as an excuse for those with power to continue to act in a manner that ensures that they retain that power. Whether they call themselves Ayatollah, Mullah, Pope or Elder, they wield the same power, the ability to make the rules to ensure their own success.

True atheism requires humility. One must be willing to accept the premise that, while a natural explanation may exist, an individual - even humanity as a whole - may not have the ability to understand the explanation. We may even lack the ability to ask the right question. Most people would rather accept that a god exists that works in ways beyond human comprehension (because man is not god) than to accept that man is not smart enough to comprehend natural phenomena. Believing in god allows the individual to stop looking, to set aside the unknown as unknowable. Religion posits that god is unlimited, where atheists must accept that it is merely the converse: man is limited.

Religion also allows humanity to set itself apart from the world, to lift man above the animal kingdom. It is hubris that prevents mankind from accepting that we are but one of the animals. It's the same conceit, the same belief that we and whomever we accept as our kind, that allowed whites to treat blacks as chattel, Christian to infantilize pagan, Sunni to demean Shiite, Hutu to hate Tutsi, and on and on throughout history and the present. Religion is but another way for a segment of humanity to deceive themselves into believing in their own superiority. Why should straight society allow gays to participate as equals when straights can point to the Bible to prove that it is they, and they alone, who should be allowed special rights: marriage, privacy in one's bedroom, the right to be considerred family to the person with whom one has chosen to build a life.

Finally, there is one fact that prevents me from accepting a supernatural afterlife, a heaven or a hell where souls are sent after death, divided by how they lived: Life is more than a test, more than an obstacle course to be completed, pass or fail. I demand more from myself than merely obeying a book of rules set down by some past civilization to govern themselves, one that has been elevated to an owner's manual for all souls, in perpetuity. I expect to conduct myself as though what I do here is all there is, that all I leave behind is a society made either better or worse by my presence. There is no heaven (the carrot) or hell (the stick) to keep me in line. There are other people, other animals, other lives, that share this space, and kindness and consideration for them makes the world we share a better place in the here and now.
 
Spiritual should be in that poll.... Theres a big difference IMO, between spirituality and religion.

I cannot vote otherwise.
 
Right- you can be spiritual, which shouldn't be measured in how often you attend church.

Nanci
 
snakewispera snr said:
Me an wisper jr are practicing Jedi's
May 4th be with you
MIKE
:cheers: When I had surgery a few years ago, the nurse asked my religion. High on pre surgery injection, I jokingly stated I was Jedi... When I came to, and bored, I started reading all the stuff printed on my wristband... Yep, there it was, Jedi, listed as religious preference. If anything had gone wrong they would of had a hard time finding that Jedi priest... I went back again for a procedure last year, and there it was on my new wristband... :grin01:

Usually when I'm around people discussing religion I like to blurt out, "I'm Atheist.... Swear to God...." Only about half get it...

I was raised in a strict religious family and got burnt out real quick, not to mention the theology classes opened my eyes to a lot of the history behind religion that the church didn't. I may not practice any longer, but the morals I was instilled with as a child are still with me...
 
I say agnostic. I was raised in a strickly Roman Catholic family. Went to Catholic school and Sunday school every week. I have probably read the whole bible at least once. I think it's a nice history book...nothing more. I believe that we didn't just appear here, that something had to have made us...or made the cells that we're made of. But at the same time it's back to the age old question...what came first the chicken or the egg. If there has to be a god to have put us here, then who made the god and so on? If we all just appeared here as a product of planets colliding, then who put the planets here?

I think religions were formed as a way to create order in this chaotic world. It works well, but in some cases causes more harm than good. There's been more killing in the name of "god"(any god, doesn't matter which one) than for any other reason :madeuce: . I think that as long as you don't kill anyone unless you HAVE TO(life in danger, family life in danger, etc) and try really hard to do what you feel is right, then no matter what god there is or isn't will be just as happy.

Just about every religion threatens that if you don't believe you're damned to hell :devil01: , and I just don't think that's right. If a god is willing to condemn a person to eternal suffering(even if they lived a perfect and caring life) just because they didn't follow the right god, then I don't think I want to hang out with that god anyway.

Then there's reincarnation which sounds totally awesome and I really hope that's what happens after this. Another shot at life, possibly as another creature. I just don't know, but I don't think anyone alive really knows FOR SURE that they are ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY correct in their belief. :shrugs:
 
CaptBogart said:
Usually when I'm around people discussing religion I like to blurt out, "I'm Atheist.... Swear to God...."

That's hot- I'm gonna start saying it!
:cheers: :cheers:

Nanci
 
When I last I engaged in this discussion, I was either young or drunk...or both. In any event, there is little original to be said here. However, since I always avail myself of an opportunity to share my opinion with the unwary...

I was born and raised in the part of the United States known as the bible belt. Like many, I considered my church community to be a central part of my life and like many I left my church as a young adult after becoming disenchanted with organized religion in general and the Southern Baptist religion in specific. In college, I converted to Roman Catholicism and still identify myself as such whenever the requirement is imposed on me. Practically, I have not participated in the sacraments for many years.

However, I still try to live my life by the bumper sticker slogan of WWJD (What Would Jesus Do?) It's a humanist message and makes me feel better about myself. That we participate in this debate is an indicator in and of itself. While I believe in the concept of evolution, I observe that our species has evolved much beyond our closest relatives (I'm not counting those of you who know who the real father of Anna Nicole's baby is.) If there was not some divine hand at work, I would think we would have had some species rival our own for domination of the planet.

It is popular practice to decry the evil perputrated by organized religion. On the other hand, I can't recall any great human suffering relieved by the World Aethist Combined Charities (Oh, I forgot...there is no such group). Like some of the other posters I consider myself spiritual, not religious. I really don't find the Jedi parody all that far fetched. Two years ago, I had by-pass surgery and spent four weeks near death. I recommend the experience to all of you that don't believe in an after life. You know, I can't think of one aethist who has written about a near death experience.

Finally, religion has inspired much of the great literature of western civilization. May I suggest you start with the book of Job?
 
I'm with Tula_Montage...my spirituality has nothing to do with any organized religion, nor "named Deity".

I believe there is something, above all else, that cannot be studied, comprehended, or achieved by mankind, and that something is spiritual in nature, only by it's intangible yet percievable presence. Everyone feels it...good luck, a streak, fate...God, Shiva, being "in the right place at the right time"...conception and birth, life as we know it...

I'm too stubborn for Chaos Theory, Intelligent Design, and The Bible. I believe there is something after this life to strive for, and that ALL of the religions throughout time immeasurable have been mankind's attempt to define and outline that goal, without truly comprehending what that goal really is. I refuse to believe everything was an "accident", and that the world evolved to what we know today purely by chance, circumstance and survival of the fittest, though I can't deny those things played a part...there MUST be a reason for everything to fit so neatly, besides just "luck of the draw"...but it is not my job nor desire to give that something a name and background story, as all religions have tried to do.

I also believe that it is extremely arrogant as humans to consider that we are the only planet to survive under the quadrillions of stars, each one supporting multiple planets of varying numbers, sizes, and distances from the sun, and deveolpe habitable conditions...perhaps the only one LIKE this one...but surely not the only one.

So I really have no idea how to define my beliefs, nor can I begin to place them into a preconceived Ideal of what they *should* be. There are FAR too many questions that I believe are impossible to answer to place any certainty or faith in ANY defined belief set...science, faith or otherwise. I do what I do, and live my life...my only goal is to live my life the best way I know how to, governed not by some philosophical list of rules, but by a self-imposed desire to do right by myself and others, and to leave this life knowing that the people I meet and the things I do were important to me, and I was to them. I only want to leave everything better than it was when I got here, at least in my small corner of existence...

Funny, to me...one of my favorite all time movie scenes is at the end of the first Men in Black...as the camera pans out and shows our entire galaxy to be merely a marble in the hands of children playing...and they each hold an entire bag of marbles exactly like the one which represents us...
 
Tula_Montage said:
Spiritual should be in that poll.... Theres a big difference IMO, between spirituality and religion.
Tula_Montage said:
I cannot vote otherwise.


I agree with you Elle. Religion is for people who don't want to go to hell, and spirituality is for people who have been there and don't want to go back.


[/QUOTE=CaptBogart] Usually when I'm around people discussing religion I like to blurt out, "I'm Atheist.... Swear to God...." Only about half get it...

I was raised in a strict religious family and got burnt out real quick, not to mention the theology classes opened my eyes to a lot of the history behind religion that the church didn't. I may not practice any longer, but the morals I was instilled with as a child are still with me...[/QUOTE]

Same here. Both my kids go to Catholic school and I try to remember how I felt growing up. My mother was a GREAT woman, but tried to force feed me her beliefs. In the Bible Jesus said, "go into your closet and pray". To me this means to go to God one on one and in your own conscience. No one is responsible for my relationship with God except me. I can hopefully help influence my children's value's, but I need to give them the space to meet God in their way, as well.

As for your choices, I can speak toward agnosticism because I've been there. An agnostic is a chicken athest; I was afraid not to believe.

I can't speak for atheists since I've never not believed, but I will say this.
There are no atheists in a burning building.
 
I have to say I'm probably none of the above. I believe in beings higher than humanity(spirits, angels and demons), but no central deities controlling them. I don't pray. I don't worship. The closest I come to worship is my reverence of nature. I basically studied religion for many years, taking pieces of this and that, to come up with a set of beliefs that made sense to me. I have read the Koran, the Torah, the Bible, several books on Hindu, Japanese Shintoism and shamanic religions(where the bulk of my views come from), Celtic religion(where the basis for my view of the afterlife comes from, with a little Karmic reincarnation thrown in), Wicca, and several other 'new-age' pagan religions. I am happy with my beliefs as of now, but am always ready to alter them to accommodate new ideas, if those ideas speak to me on a spiritual level. I've got 2 book on Taoism(a Chinese religion), on their way as we speak so who knows what tomorrow holds.

I am an opponent of organized religion, at least in the idea of what it has become. I believe the Bible had the best basic idea, of what a church(temple, mosque, synagogue, whatever). I am paraphrasing as I can't seem to find my Good Book, but "Wherever two, or three, shall gather and worship, that shall be a church." Anybody feel free to correct me or provide book, chapter, and verse. In my experience, the churches I have attended(I was Christian until about 16) both large and small, have been ineffective bureaucracies. Granted this may be just my experience, but in talking to friends and others about this, it seems to be a pretty common feeling. Also the grandiose nature of some places of worship, fly in the face of the tenets of the religion they are intended to represent. As long as there are homeless, hungry or otherwised disenfranchised people, than I think the new b-ball gym, for the church or synagogue can wait.

Sorry for ranting folks. We now return to your regularly scheduled post.
 
I'd be considered Theist, Christian. Raised that way. I'll stay that way if only to get to heaven and see all my pets again :D. Hell I can close to selling my soul to the other side to get one of them back. Ah, but that's kind of a no-no :nope: God to me is kind of a super - parent (when you are a smaller child)- tries to give some direction, warn you off things, but keeps loving you no matter how many times you screw up. I don't think anyone has a good handle on who or what he is, so he can be different things to different people.
I like your comment of 'no atheists in burning buildings'- for me its 'no atheists with a sick pet' :rolleyes: Of course I'm a little obsessed with my pets.
:-offtopic Bezil was my ferret. LOVED that ferret.
 
I voted "thesis" only because I believe in a Greater Being. I tell people I am Muslim only because I believe that there is One God and it seems to me some people believe there may be more than One God. But even saying I am Muslim is too simple.

I sort of believe in everything said so far. Some one will argue that we can travel into outer space forever and I response with "Well, only until you reach the side of the marble". Whose to say that we and what we know to be out there does not reside inside a marble. We could be a speck of dust in someone's beard for all we know.

I believe in evolution as it was directed by the hand of the One God even if that One God was the race of being that were forced off Mars as in the Gary Sinise movie.

I believe religion was created by man so he could have an explaination for the unexplainable. The next logical step would be to think that man made God to have someone to blame unexplainable tragadies (wrong spelling but you know what I mean); but, I still believe in One God. Marx said religion is the opiium of the masses meaning religion makes people blind to reality.

I beleive in the Ancient Faith(Native American) as I feel that we live in a world where each living creature has a spirit and a right just as much as we do to be here on this planet. I believe that the animals are the wisest of all and we can learn from them.

As for death. Let me relate this. I was raised by my grandmother and I watched her die and found her dead. For many years after that I would have this dream.

It would be ghostly night and I would be standing in front of an old gothic house with only one window showing light in it. I would walk up the creaky stair and open the door. The front room was littered with dusty cots that had cobwebs on them but from the front door I could see the soft shine of light from the hallway upstairs. I would go up the stairs and start walking to the door that had the light coming from under the door. The closer I got to the door the colder the air got and when I put my hand on the door knob to open the door, it was freezing cold. I would wake up in a cold sweat in fear. Finally after having this dream for six to seven years at least once a month I decided to end it and open that door even if I had a heart attack doing it. I had to keep saying to myself it was only a dream. My hand on the door knob, so cold that my hand stuck to it, I opened the door and . . . .

In front of me was the most beautiful valley, waterfall, river, pastures, forests that I have ever seen. In my head was a soft musical voice that said "Don't worry, she is okay.". My grandmother, Mom, was fine. She was out there tending her garden and being happy. I believe that even though our bodies die and rot away the soul and spirit that makes us who we are goes on to something different, something better, somewhere else.

Who knows, we may be star travelers going from planet to planet after each death. I like to keep all my options open.

Okay, friends, that my crazy world. Not black and white nor is it gray. It's blues, greens, reds, oranges, all the colors of the rainbow.
:crazy02:
 
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