Pokie noses! Babies have arrived (graphic and sad ending)

As morbid as this clutch is (select handful being euthanised and tested for IBD in order to rule out or condemn the rest of the clutch and their parents), I am over the moon and stupidly excited

They started pipping yesterday afternoon. 2 heads out. 7 hours later, one more head out. Another 5 or so hours later and the first two babies were out and another head was pipping. This morning there is a grand total of 3 babies out and 2 heads waiting, plus one sadly DIE.

Trust me, the most impatient person on the planet to get a very staggered clucth in regards to the hatching rate. However due to the one DIE which I suspect had issues breaking the shell due to the amount of scratch marks on the surface, should I leave the other eggs to it themselves or attempt to slit them? I am of the thought that if a corn will hatch, it will break it's own shell. However these eggs were a little strange in that they were very large and rubbery. I will wait until after I am home from work tonight (9 hours away) before I do anything of course.

Anyway, pictures!













Look at the belly colour on this one!



Hateling!



DIE

Really beautiful pictures, Elle!!

Thanks Nanci. I'm paranoid about hatchlings escaping from the incubator so once out their eggs I'm giving them a couple of hours to knock on the doors of their unhatched siblings, then I whisk them away to their quarters. Plus I like to know which snake came out of which egg. Particularly when it's a clucth of predicted all normals.

Congrats girlie. I'm sorry about the DIE but tending more towards less intervention nowadays, personally. I don't think each baby is any less precious, but they have to make it without special measures, otherwise I'll end up with a whole special needs rack!

I would agree with you J9. They have 8 hours till I come home, then I'm going to start poking them! (gently) haha.

Considering part of this clutch is to be euthanised for testing anyway, I'd be relieved to find one or more DIE, so I wouldn't have make that choice. I'm glad you're checking the corns for IBD. There haven't been many reported cases in colubrids, but it could become a major issue if the herp world doesn't get a handle on it. So I'm proud of you, but I'm also sorry that some of these won't grow up.

Candle and slit Elle... In fact cut windows to stop the idiots drowning them selves.....
TBH... Just test the already dead one... if it's positive then think about the other.... Well that's my opinion anyway.... Best of luck girl.....

I couldn't euthanize the living ones, that's for sure! I don't care what test it's for.... They're just tooooo beautiful. I'm with testing the DIE, though. Good idea, I think?

These babies are so sweet, with their pretty baby faces!

Lovely baby's! they don't look like normals, are they?

Are you testing for IBD because of a specific reason?

dionythicus said:

Considering part of this clutch is to be euthanised for testing anyway, I'd be relieved to find one or more DIE, so I wouldn't have make that choice. I'm glad you're checking the corns for IBD. There haven't been many reported cases in colubrids, but it could become a major issue if the herp world doesn't get a handle on it. So I'm proud of you, but I'm also sorry that some of these won't grow up.

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Well, as you know colubrids can carry the virus, and my decision to breed was based on the speed of testing. I can breed a corn clutch in a couple of months. Boas on the other hand (the species I have) is 11 months plus. For turnaround purposes I chose the corns. As heartless as it may sound, I specifically bred two of my snakes I knew would produce normal corns. I know I won't get too attached to these guys, I can't. I do however have to raise them up a bit. At their current size and weight, sending off organs is a little silly! I don't mind the work involved. It's rather exciting really. And it's all breeding experience and a learning curve. So the DIE will not be tested. It's already not suitable for autopsy (in the freezer), and too small to begin with.

I figure I should do what I can to learn more about this disease. By testing babies, and if they come back positive for IBD then it means that it can indeed be passed from parent/s to baby. Which is what we suspect anyway. The next step is to breed a pair of boas which were in the closest proximity to Clementine. (The mother of the corns was chosen due to being directly below her, so if anyone was to catch the virus via mite transfer, it would be her).

snakewispera snr said:

Candle and slit Elle... In fact cut windows to stop the idiots drowning them selves.....
TBH... Just test the already dead one... if it's positive then think about the other.... Well that's my opinion anyway.... Best of luck girl.....

Click to expand...

I came home to another bab out the egg and 6 more heads poking out. I think they will be just fine. If they drown they drown. I have 4 big healthy babies out. Thats plenty for testing purposes.

Irish Eyes (Mrs.Z) said:

I couldn't euthanize the living ones, that's for sure! I don't care what test it's for.... They're just tooooo beautiful. I'm with testing the DIE, though. Good idea, I think?

These babies are so sweet, with their pretty baby faces!

Click to expand...

As said above, for the type of biopsy I need to get done on certain organs, these guys need to be a few months old and have a good bit of size on them.

Blutengel said:

Lovely baby's! they don't look like normals, are they?

Are you testing for IBD because of a specific reason?

Click to expand...

Last year, almost a year ago to the day actually, one of my boas died due to severe renal failure. An autopsy showed she was positive for IBD. In that year not a single one of my snakes have shown any signs or symptoms of the virus, despite having 3 pythons in very close proximity of said boa. It's either a miracle or the virus is just biding it's time. However I am a complete quarantine and hygiene nazi around my snakes these days. The whole clutch was incubated in a separate room to my current reptile collection as to prevent any cross contamination which may interfere with any test results.

They are indeed normals. Just as I expected.

The newest wee one out is dark! And shiney and rainbowfied and, ok... actually rather fetching. I must admit, that is a pretty normal corn. Man that hurt to say...

Ah ok, I figured you would not test just out of curiosity.

I thought boa's would get sich form IBD and pythons are just carriers, not getting sick but able to transfer it?

The opposite. Boas are carriers, and can live for a very long time when they contract the disease. They may not show signs or symptoms but may harbour it. Pythons on the other hand cannot harbour IBD. Once contracted they will succumb within 2 weeks on average. They seem to have absolutely no resistance to the virus whatsoever. Thus why I consider my own pythons a true test of how far IBD has actually spread in my collection (if at all). They should be dead by now!

Ok, just a mix up then on my side. Glad it surely did not spread to your pythons then!

No problem. If you have like, an hour, why not read my documented experience with the disease and how it affected Clementine.

http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87758&highlight=clementine

I have it opened and saved to open in my browser every time I open the browser, so I will read it the next few days I guess Quite interesting!

Interesting? Heartbreaking is more like it

Of course that too Elle, you know that But it is also interesting. I have read a bit already and your words of goodbye to your lassie hit my heart

Yep. She is still missed sorely. I still have her half brother who is doing well. He is a massive strapping young lad, and a fantastic example of the locale. He will be biospised at some point this year too. He is big enough to handle the invasive proceedure.

I so much hope it won't be positive for you and the snake!