Medical Marijuana - Welcome to the club Washington DC

[danielle]

Snoop Dawg is a pot head Eric,lol concentrated and thought deeply hehehe

 

[vetusvates]

Snoop Dawg is a pot head Eric,lol concentrated and thought deeply hehehe

Danielle, I am busted. You have uncovered the very zing and zest of my sharp and sarcastic humor.

You my gurl, home slice.

 

[Shiraa]

No, I haven't. Go back and reread my post. Although my effects probably speak for more people than you may think, NEVER did I speak of anyone's experience but my own.

Fair enough.

I take responsibility for my "name". I'm not that powerful to be responsible for the good name of all you responsible smokers nevermind keeping it illegal.

When I say "give the rest of us a bad name" I am referring to the tendency for non-smokers to negatively judge the demographic as a whole when they see someone acting in a way that is not necessarily representative of "the rest" of us. That is to say, a big argument used against even responsible smokers is the ones who do fall into the "burnt-out idiot" stereotype.

Again, I speak for myself and yes, having minimal consequences from pot did make it easier for me to justify trying coke.

Yes, you do speak for yourself. I've tried coke (among a few other harder drugs) out of curiosity more than anything. I would have tried them whether I had already smoked pot or not. That's just my nature - I like new and different experiences. Weed wasn't the "gateway." The fact still remains, in any case, that poor decisions on both our parts do not by any means represent the pot-smoking demographic as a whole, or even the majority of it.

Yup, just me and Cheech and Chong.

If you have to resort to using pop culture icons who were obviously meant to portray the "Dave's not here, man" stereotype, it's pretty clear that your arguments are lacking in substance.

If I didn't know better, I'd say you were paraniod.

No, just educated.

 

[chuk_138]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that the only "drug" I have ever experimented with was a PLANT! Gateway drug my ___. People with no willpower looking for a scapegoat.

 

[VickyChaiTea]

A plant that has medicinal properties is very different than a manufactured, extracted, or altered plant used as medicine. Name one other plant that is regulated by the Federal Government as a Class A Controlled Substance in it's natural state. Just one...that's all I ask...


None that I can think of. Why? Just because there are no others means it's not dangerous when used in the long term?

Actually, it is easily the minority that shows addiction and withdrawal. It is also the minority that shows paranoia and psychosis. What you seem to be missing is that all of your fears over the "deadly marijuana" are not even statistically relevant when you look at the actual data, rather than the Anti-Drug Commission's perception of the data. Read the research in the links on the NORML page that I gave you. Even the research that is designed to show how dangerous it is does not support the claims you are making. Do everyone in this topic a favor, and start to base you complaints on actual evidence, rather than anecdotal paranoia and opinions.

So what if it's the minority? It's an avoidable danger that people are putting themselves and OTHERS into when they smoke it. Driving while high can be very dangerous.


Smoking ANYTHING can cause cancer. Walking down the street in any major US city can cause cancer. Eating food with FDC Red #9 can cause cancer. Walking into any building that hasn't been renovated since 1983 can cause cancer. Your exposure to carcinogens is greater in your daily routine than it is after smoking a joint.

Just because other things can cause cancer too doesn't make the cancer that pot smoke can give you any less real. You keep comparing it to more deadly things. Just because it's not the worst drug in the world doesn't mean it's not dangerous at all! And talk about anecdotal evidence, have you one study to show exactly how many carcinogens you encounter on your daily walk compared to how many are in pot? Hmm?


Memory loss, paranoia, and psychosis are temporary effects found only in a small minority of research test subjects. If you don't ever want to experience it, don't ever take the chance and smoke a joint. Making something illegal based on statistically irrelavant data is senseless.

How is it irrelevant that pot HARMS people? Being depressed is HARMFULL. Psychosis is harmful.

What negative side effects? Oh, you mean the negative side effects experienced by less than 20% of all test subjects? Those side effects? A higher pecentage of individuals experience adverse reactions to the flu shot on a yearly basis...

Flu shots are a necessity for some people, are completely regulated and not used recreationally. Not really comparable to pot.

When are you going to realize that forbidding grown adults from altering their perception is not going to work? People smoke and drink because we enjoy it. It feels good to have a beer, smoke a joint, or have a cigarrette. Human beings are creatures of pleasure, and as such, we will always seek out ways to feel pleasure. Tobacco and alcohol are 2 very destructive, and perfectly legal methods of accomplishing this.

You keep comparing it to other things! Tobacco and alcohol are bad in my book too! Just because it feels good to smoke or drink doesn't mean it's ok to smoke or drink. Far too many people get addicted, hurt themselves, and hurt OTHERS, ruin OTHERS lives by using these substances. People die from tobacco, alcohol, and pot! People kill other people BECAUSE of alcohol, tobacco, and pot! THAT'S why I want them gone.

Marijuana is a MUCH less destructive method that is currently outlawed because of very ridiculous myths created from governmental paranoia. Wake up, and give grown adults the ability to decide for themselves if the risks associated with recreational marijuana use outweigh the benefits or not.

ONCE AGAIN! Just because it's not the worst doesn't mean it's not bad at ALL!

Nobody will ever require you to smoke a joint. Nobody will ever take away your right to decide for yourself that pot, tobacco and alcohol are not something you wish to try. Stop for bidding me, and stop trying to run MY life without my permission.

That's all anyone is asking...

Creating a law that would save thousands of people every year from dying in car accidents, lung cancer, and drug related shootings really is ruining your life, isn't it? All of those things effect not only who is using them, but the people AROUND them. By using any of those, you can get addicted in one form or another, get lung cancer, liver failure, memory loss, psychosis, lung disease, kidney disease, ect! Drinking or smoking pot before driving can cause you to KILL people. People are getting shot left and right over drugs all the time. I want them GONE. I'm sooooo bad for not wanting to let people potentially ruin their lives, aren't I?

 

[VickyChaiTea]

Vicky, first off, learn to spell and do grammar checks. My name is CHUK, not Chuck. Second, do you have grandma's medical history to know she never had cancer? Most people tend to lie about their medical history or never bother going to the doctor. As far as temporary side effects go, what about alcohol, cough medicine, etc. You are ignorant to the facts. You need to go to hulu and watch "The Emperor Wears No Clothes". Maybe then you can gain some insight on the conversation. You have no basis for your argument and yet you continue. If you knew exactly what everyone does when no one is watching, you would be shocked. Half of the legal system(if not more) is made up of cokeheads and alcoholics. I'm done with this subject for today. Take your 19 year old lack of knowledge and.......you know. Chime in when you have an intelligent argument supported by facts, not opinion. Which is basically not anytime soon........

Wow... alrighty then, because age ALWAYS shows how smart someone is. Always. Yup.

Sorry I misspelled your username.

Nope, my friend told me that story and I guess I didn't think to go looking for her medical files. Not saying he couldn't be lying though.

Yeah, what about alcohol? If you haven't noticed, I've been against that too this WHOLE TIME.

No government is EVER going to be perfect, no system can be right 100% of the time, and effective 100% of the time. To think that could happen would be idiotic. I have no doubt that a certain amount of dirty cops, crooked politicians, ect, exist.

You, by far, have the weakest argument for pot.

 

[tyflier]

Here we go again. You've run out of actual arguments so you're switching to "YEAH WELL UR YOUNG SO SHUT UP". And some of you actually wonder why Rich removed the age bar on posts. When I talk about stoners, I don't just mean my 17 and 18 year old "friends" (since you've all decided to call them that); I also mean my 40 to 50 year old friends, and 20 to the 30 year olds. The amount of people I know who have ever admitted to still using marijuana past their teens drops significantly from 20 to 30 and is almost nonexistant from 40 to 50. I'm sure an unbiased study on the demographics of marijuana users vs age would prove true to my statements. And speaking of studies, where is this "research" that will open my eyes to the magic of pot? Show me an article from an accredited medical journal, and I'll read it.

By the way, it IS a choice. You've lived a sheltered life if you think that drugs, alcohol, and cigarettes aren't readily available at any decent party or friend. I can't even count all the times during my high school career where I had to defend myself for NOT doing those things.

You have obviously not done any research on the subject, yet you sit here and insist that your group of friends represent the mean average of marijuana smokers. They don't. You and your friends have not even been alive as long as me and my friends have been smoking pot. How can you possibly have any sort of realistic input on the subject?

If you would care to read through the links provided by me many posts ago, you would realize that ALL of your arguments are based on myth and opinion, where ALL of my arguments are based on and supported by actual scientific tests done by pharmeceutical companies and the US Government. Read something that gives you the data without the spin and opinion.

When you actually have something worth contributing, I would be happy to continue the discussion. However, since every argument you(and VickyChaiTea) have made is based on ignorance and mythology, I'm not going to waste any more of my breath trying to have this discussion with you. You obviously already know everything there is to know at 16, so why am I even bothering?

Good thing you can't vote...

 

[tyflier]

None that I can think of. Why? Just because there are no others means it's not dangerous when used in the long term?

You miss the point. Marijuana is not harmful. Not because it is natural, and not because it is a plant, but because statistical and analytical data has proven that it is not harmful. You can argue against that with your opinion all you want. It is still a fact.

So what if it's the minority? It's an avoidable danger that people are putting themselves and OTHERS into when they smoke it. Driving while high can be very dangerous.

The point is that there are millions of substances and chemicals that are and are not federally regulated that are FAR more dangerous than pot. But since you refuse to read anything that isn't beleagured in opinion and myth, you'll never know...

Just because other things can cause cancer too doesn't make the cancer that pot smoke can give you any less real. You keep comparing it to more deadly things. Just because it's not the worst drug in the world doesn't mean it's not dangerous at all! And talk about anecdotal evidence, have you one study to show exactly how many carcinogens you encounter on your daily walk compared to how many are in pot? Hmm?

You really are ignoring any and all facts in an effort to come out on top in this. Do some research, sweetheart. Read about the smog content in an average American city, and how it effects the lunngs and cancer rate of people living there. Read the carcinogenic properties of such wonders as asbestos and lead, and see how many buildings that haven't been renovated since before 1983 still contain these carcinogens.

I provided you with a page that will give you links to every scientific study done on marijuana. You simply refuse to read any of them.

How is it irrelevant that pot HARMS people? Being depressed is HARMFULL. Psychosis is harmful.

How relevant is it that the data supporting these statements is non-existent? If pot was as dangerous and deadly as you seem to think it is, there should be some empirical evidence stating it. Care to provide a link?

Flu shots are a necessity for some people, are completely regulated and not used recreationally. Not really comparable to pot.

Nothing that you have said in this entire topic is comparable to pot, because none of it is based on fact. Why start now?:shrugs:

You keep comparing it to other things! Tobacco and alcohol are bad in my book too!

Your book...not mine. Nice that I can make that choice for myself.

Just because it feels good to smoke or drink doesn't mean it's ok to smoke or drink.

But it IS OK to smoke AND drink. As much as I want, whenever I want.

Far too many people get addicted, hurt themselves, and hurt OTHERS, ruin OTHERS lives by using these substances. People die from tobacco, alcohol, and pot! People kill other people BECAUSE of alcohol, tobacco, and pot! THAT'S why I want them gone.

It's not your choice to make. This is not a communistic or fascist society wherein the desire of a few dictates the lives of the many. If you don't like it, don't smoke it.

And pot has never killed any person in history by itself. Marijuana has NEVER been the official cause of death in any autopsy. Ever. Find me one. Just one autopsy report showing the cause of death as Marijuana use.

ONCE AGAIN! Just because it's not the worst doesn't mean it's not bad at ALL!

And once again you completely miss the point. These other substances are legal. Pot should be as well. That's the point.

Creating a law that would save thousands of people every year from dying in car accidents, lung cancer, and drug related shootings really is ruining your life, isn't it?

Your proposed prohibition will do none of those things. It hasn't in the past, it won't in the future. This is a dream world that is as far removed from reality as your myths about pot. Do. Some. Research.

All of those things effect not only who is using them, but the people AROUND them. By using any of those, you can get addicted in one form or another, get lung cancer, liver failure, memory loss, psychosis, lung disease, kidney disease, ect! Drinking or smoking pot before driving can cause you to KILL people. People are getting shot left and right over drugs all the time. I want them GONE. I'm sooooo bad for not wanting to let people potentially ruin their lives, aren't I?

You are. You are so bad for trying to decide for everyone else what is and what isn't OK to do with their own bodies. NONE of those side effects are symptoms of marijuana use. Not one of them. Period. Drinking or smoking pot before driving is always a bad idea. Smart people don't do that...even when they are stoned or drunk. Your arguments are childish and silly, as well as based on myth.

You want some real crime statistics? Look up the drug related casualties in a country such as Denmark. Go ahead...I'll wait. Pot is legal there. So are many other substances commonly abused in this country. Yet they somehow manag to have a lower murder rate, lower crime per capita rate, and lower numbers of medically treated addictions. Go figure...:shrugs:

More violence is created because of prohibition than in spite of it. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Shiraa]

What I want to know is how Vicki came to be under the impression that smoking pot can cause depression. Inventing side effects is fun!

Don't smoke pot, you'll turn into a crazed llama that commits hate crimes and clubs baby seals!

 

[ceduke]

What I want to know is how Vicki came to be under the impression that smoking pot can cause depression. Inventing side effects is fun!

Don't smoke pot, you'll turn into a crazed llama that commits hate crimes and clubs baby seals!

Indeed, pot has been used successfully as a mood stabilizer for many people. It works that way for me, but fortunately so does a less expensive drug.

 

[vetusvates]

You want some real crime statistics? Look up the drug related casualties in a country such as Denmark. Go ahead...I'll wait. Pot is legal there. So are many other substances commonly abused in this country. Yet they somehow manag to have a lower murder rate, lower crime per capita rate, and lower numbers of medically treated addictions. Go figure...:shrugs:

Chris, I'm not so sure about outright legal, but Denmark, Belgium, and the Netherlands are all super cool for a variety of reasons. Not the least of which is staying out of people's business, and not going whacko over small amounts of marijuana.

But hey, these are countries that've been maturing into political entities for at least the last 2000 (instead of 200) years,...what do they know.

 

[tyflier]

Chris, I'm not so sure about outright legal, but Denmark, Belgium, and the Netherlands are all super cool for a variety of reasons. Not the least of which is staying out of people's business, and not going whacko over small amounts of marijuana.

But hey, these are countries that've been maturing into political entities for at least the last 2000 (instead of 200) years,...what do they know.

To be perfectly honest, the legalities of it have always confused me there. I know that in the right place at the right time, for all intents and purposes, it may as well be legal, according to many close friends with experience. I've never been there, though it is a place I would love to visit, for a wide variety of reasons.

 

[Teddy Roosevelt]

You have obviously not done any research on the subject, yet you sit here and insist that your group of friends represent the mean average of marijuana smokers. They don't. You and your friends have not even been alive as long as me and my friends have been smoking pot. How can you possibly have any sort of realistic input on the subject?

If you would care to read through the links provided by me many posts ago, you would realize that ALL of your arguments are based on myth and opinion, where ALL of my arguments are based on and supported by actual scientific tests done by pharmeceutical companies and the US Government. Read something that gives you the data without the spin and opinion.

When you actually have something worth contributing, I would be happy to continue the discussion. However, since every argument you(and VickyChaiTea) have made is based on ignorance and mythology, I'm not going to waste any more of my breath trying to have this discussion with you. You obviously already know everything there is to know at 16, so why am I even bothering?

Good thing you can't vote...

You must be too high to read my posts, or you would've read the part where I have a large group of friends who are old enough to be your moms and dads, and maybe if you're going to continue using age as an argument, you would've even gotten my age right (so far you've missed it twice).

As for the posts you made on an earlier page... I saw them. Let me reiterate:

Show me an article from an accredited medical journal, and I'll read it.

 

[Shiraa]

What, government-funded and publishedstudies on marijuana? Say it isn't so! This only shows an abstract of each study, but I'm sure it would be no trouble at all to find the full articles with a quick search.

 

[cornsnakes101]

It's about time. To those that think legalizing marijuana is a bad idea, Marijuana is an herb there's nothing wrong with it surpassing the dangerous effects of tobacco or alcohol, the only time Marijuana becomes dangerous is when it is chemically combined with dangerous drugs such as cocaine, lsd, and whatever else they want to. Marijuana should be legalized as a recreational drug and if they do at least make an age limit of 18, the legal age of smoking tobacco.

 

[Dinah]

Creating a law that would save thousands of people every year from dying in car accidents, lung cancer, and drug related shootings really is ruining your life, isn't it? All of those things effect not only who is using them, but the people AROUND them. By using any of those, you can get addicted in one form or another, get lung cancer, liver failure, memory loss, psychosis, lung disease, kidney disease, ect! Drinking or smoking pot before driving can cause you to KILL people. People are getting shot left and right over drugs all the time. I want them GONE. I'm sooooo bad for not wanting to let people potentially ruin their lives, aren't I?

This is America, most folks here aren't to interested in the government telling them how to run their private lives. This isn't some sort of Nanny state where the govt gets to decide what I am having for dinner so that they can make sure it is complete, balanced, and healthy. This is a free country, people can have unprotected sex, eat a cheese burger, light up a cigarette, or have a shot of tequila they might not be healthy habit but regardless of their health or lack of health they are nobody else's business. Doing any of those things does not infringe on someone else's rights and marijuana is not any different...lets say that the only person I am hurting is myself.....who cares if I hurt myself? Why do you want to live where the govt can tell you what to do with your body, why do you want someone else to decide what is the best course of action for your life and your body? I have two young kids and even they understand the concept of worry about yourself, and let other people be in charge of themselves. I can understand about the worry of hurting others but drug violence is a symptom of drugs being illegal and especially with marijuana it is not because the marijuana makes people violent. I can understand your concern regarding driving and such. But you cant ban something just because driving while under the influence is unsafe. Nyquil is unsafe for driving, so is benadryl, so is a lot of things. Lots of people in this country drink but would NEVER drink and drive it isn't right to make alcohol illegal just because someone will, deal with the someone who drinks and drives and leave the people who are minding their business and being responsible alone. Or what about people like me, I don't drive at all. I haven't smoked pot since before I had kids, but I can tell you with certainty that no matter how high I got back then, the only person I ever risked killing on my bike is myself, and even then it would be tough to do.

Why make growing a plant and minding your own business into a crime? Any rational and unbiased look at the issue will show that that is ultimately all we are talking about a plant. A plant, there are lots of plants that are dangerous to people for example here in FL especially in the Keys where I am from they have a lot of poison wood. Terribly nasty stuff causes harm to people who are allergic to it, but it is legal. The same thing with Cedar, I have been hospitalized over a reaction I had to cedar, but those plants that truly pose a danger to me are legal. Other people are also allergic to Cedar and poisonwood since it has such harmful effects maybe it should also be illegal? I mean if the govt is in your opinion supposed to save us from all the dangerous and scary things in the world, then does that mean they are slaking by allowing cedar and poison wood to be legal? What about the bees? Bees and ants can definitely kill a person so maybe the govt should protect us from them as well and destroy the bees? Maybe even the government will come and bust me for possession when they find out I have bees living in the back part of my 10 acres? Perhaps they will send some armed Bee Enforcement Agents to come and arrest me and break up my family and send my kids to foster care, because of the menace I am posing to society by having bees on my property.

For me it all comes down to having the right to make a private choice, and I already know how I feel about private citizens rights to make decisions for themselves and I have trust and confidence in my fellow citizens to run their own lives.

 

[wstphal]

For me it all comes down to having the right to make a private choice, and I already know how I feel about private citizens rights to make decisions for themselves and I have trust and confidence in my fellow citizens to run their own lives.

You hit the nail on the head! This whole thing has been all about right to make our own decisions even if unsafe vs regulate to keep us safe.

 

[tyflier]

You must be too high to read my posts, or you would've read the part where I have a large group of friends who are old enough to be your moms and dads, and maybe if you're going to continue using age as an argument, you would've even gotten my age right (so far you've missed it twice).

Not surprisingly, you have completely missed the point...yet again. The point is that you entire group of friends, regardless of their ages, does not account as a majority figure of marijuana smokers. Regardless of their ages and how many friends you have, they cannot possibly account for a majority.

You do not have to be an alcoholoic to drink alcohol. You do not have to be a pot head to smoke pot. Evidently, none of your friends have leraned self control or moderation. They are not the mean average of users. Period.

As for the posts you made on an earlier page... I saw them. Let me reiterate:

Start HERE.

This page will link you to actual studies performed by actual scientists.

Now...where is even one single piece of evidence to support your claims? Just one piece, please... Neither you nor VickyChaiTea have proffered a single piece of evidenciary support for all of your wild and baseless claims. Don't you think it is about time you started supporting your blather with facts?

 

[jpccusa]

Where is that dang "jpccusa"...???

He/she always stirs up this fashizzle and then runs off.

There are some topics that, while still very much interested in observing the difference of opinions, I lack the knowledge, the experience, or the passion to be an active contributor. I am more of an spectator rather than a constant fashizzler (or would it be fashizzlenator?) in those instances.

And I am a he.

 

[vetusvates]

Great picture, JP. I will remember now. No offense intended.
And you seem to be on point, as far as picking topics important to what is going on in the world, and how it effects people.
I think you know I try to soften things sometimes with a little humor.

Fashizzler is good...but I like fashizzle-slinger. :laugh: