That's your problem. Pet stores.
It may take some digging around, but you'll get better animals from actual breeders that are doing their best with their animals.
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O my gosh I want a ball python!!!!
- Thread starter Nitelion94
- Start date
It may take some digging around, but you'll get better animals from actual breeders that are doing their best with their animals.
snakewispera snr
The Devils Advocate
How can you disagree with all of it and then say that some are expensive?All of it. That's an opinionated view from an outside source looking at the market, and hearsay. They can be expensive, if you're looking for an investment, but a normal Ball Python runs average from $10-20 each. Picky eaters varies from animal to animal, and is far from as common as it used to be. Out of 100+ Ball Pythons that we have, we have one picky eater. She's growing out of it with ease. Spot on temps are another exaggerated rumor. Different things work for different keepers, and as long as you're not keeping them at ridiculous temperatures; they'll do fine. 87F-90F works fine.
Any other questions?
And you are also telling me that they don't go off their food during breeding season and it can be hard to get them back into feeding mode after laying...
And a 3 degree variation isn't keeping temps spot on......
Some are expensive. Some Corn Snakes are expensive, some cars are expensive. It doesn't mean all of them are. The expensive animals are investments. Normals are cheap. Pastels are cheap. Yellowbelly's are cheap. Etc. Compare and contrast.How can you disagree with all of it and then say that some are expensive?
And you are also telling me that they don't go off their food during breeding season and it can be hard to get them back into feeding mode after laying...
And a 3 degree variation isn't keeping temps spot on......
If you don't allow your temperatures to fluctuate too much during winter, they don't go off feed. If you're breeding your animals, that's what you have to account for. The longest we've had any of our females take to get feeding after laying is 2 weeks. Not exactly long.
If they need spot on temperatures, how do they survive in the wild? I guarantee you they wouldn't, and they would have been wiped off of the evolutionary ladder long ago. 3 degree variation is what I recommend. Others go hotter, or colder. I know breeder's keeper theirs at 93F, or cooler than 87F. You really have no argument here, other than to argue for the sake of arguing.
Now you tell me. Where does your experience lie with this species? How mny have you owned? Bred?
RobbiesCornField
Bring it on.
Oh gee, I don't know. Maybe because they're not in just one spot in the wild. They have the ability to roam to find their ideal temperatures, instead of only having to choose from two sides of a tub or tank. They're also a burrowing species, so they can find a burrow that sticks to a temperature they prefer.
snakewispera snr
The Devils Advocate
I think we'll agree to disagree...
As for breeding... Every year we put together about 5 - 10 clutches..
perhaps not as many as you, but enough to know Morphs cost... Feeding can become an issue and temps are critical.... Or perhaps thats just British ones... :shrugs:
Not exactly. When they move around too much to find that 'idealistic' temperature, they become a target and possible prey. At that, you have the various climatic patterns such as storms, dry season, etc, that just simply don't offer that 'perfect' environment; and moving around too much to find that 'perfect' environment could cost the animal it's life.
I believe we'll have to.
European and American market is different. We have plenty of morphs that you don't have, and vice versa. It's breeding season right now. Females are building, and males are still feeding.
Morph cost is a different aspect all together. You had an individual ask about getting a Ball, which one replies they are expensive. Yes they can be... towards investments. If someone is looking for one as a pet, realistically, they're not. Why do they have to buy an Albino Genetic Stripe, or a Super Pastel Fader? They have more options than investing.
Ball Pythons are incredibly variable. You have both color and pattern to look at with normals. You can have some with wacky, busy patterns; or reduced pattern animals. It sounds like a high gold normal.
Outcast
ATPSS
Ok. I wasn't quite sure. I have only ever seen one pastel in person and he was quite a looker. I actually wish I had been in the store when the guy came in to give it to the store.. i would have stopped him at the door and taken it home with me, for all I know that poor guy is dead, because the store owner is what you would call a hoarder, and does not know nearly as much about snakes as he thinks he does.... which is why half of his snakes died within a weeks time.
Jessicat
All Pied Everything
Jessicat said:I haven't visited this forum in at least a few days, possibly a week, and this thread is still in my "new posts" search.
Not sure you caught my meaning... to make it a bit more clear the picture is a troll.
Daenerys
Mother of Dragons
:eek1:
You know, I used to really like you, but I find that statement extremely offensive...
tyflier
[Insert Witty Commentary]
Wow. Just...I mean...Holy Crap!! WTH is this thread about?!
Ball Pythons--
Typically, anything but a normal is going to run upwards of $100. Not sure about anyone else, but when I was 16, $100 was a fair amount of money for a pet.
They go off feed. This is not a myth, this is a fact. They often go off feed before winter sets in. They often go off feed before breeding season begins. The often go off feed post-breeding. They often go off feed due to minor changes in temperature, humidity, surrounding activity, and location. In general, and very typically, ball pythons can be difficult feeders. Some will refuse to eat for several months at a time due to no discernible reason whatsoever, then suddenly eat ravenously, again, for no discernible reason.
Compared to the consistency of such snakes as corns and kings...ball pythons are picky eaters.
Temperature and humidty are much more important to these animals. Minor fluctuations up or down in temperature and humidity can cause a variety of issues.
Someone claiming to be incredibly knowledgeable asked how they survive in the wild if they are that sensitive. The answer is by retreating underground where temperatures and humidity levels are almost always stable, dependant upon the depth of the burrow. When the plains of Africa are 125*F, they go into a burrow that is sitting at around 90*F. When the plains drop into the low 40*F range, they go into a burrow that sits at a comfortable 75*F range to brumate. Don't make the mistake of thinking a tiny, little glass aquarium with a heat mat and a couple inches of shredded substrate is even remotely comparable to a wild habitat range. That's just plain silly...
As for the rest of this thread...Wow. Just...wow....:nope:
Ball Pythons--
Typically, anything but a normal is going to run upwards of $100. Not sure about anyone else, but when I was 16, $100 was a fair amount of money for a pet.
They go off feed. This is not a myth, this is a fact. They often go off feed before winter sets in. They often go off feed before breeding season begins. The often go off feed post-breeding. They often go off feed due to minor changes in temperature, humidity, surrounding activity, and location. In general, and very typically, ball pythons can be difficult feeders. Some will refuse to eat for several months at a time due to no discernible reason whatsoever, then suddenly eat ravenously, again, for no discernible reason.
Compared to the consistency of such snakes as corns and kings...ball pythons are picky eaters.
Temperature and humidty are much more important to these animals. Minor fluctuations up or down in temperature and humidity can cause a variety of issues.
Someone claiming to be incredibly knowledgeable asked how they survive in the wild if they are that sensitive. The answer is by retreating underground where temperatures and humidity levels are almost always stable, dependant upon the depth of the burrow. When the plains of Africa are 125*F, they go into a burrow that is sitting at around 90*F. When the plains drop into the low 40*F range, they go into a burrow that sits at a comfortable 75*F range to brumate. Don't make the mistake of thinking a tiny, little glass aquarium with a heat mat and a couple inches of shredded substrate is even remotely comparable to a wild habitat range. That's just plain silly...
As for the rest of this thread...Wow. Just...wow....:nope:
Nitelion94
I am The Nitelion
Yes I got that. But I in no way see how this was a troll and it was not meant to be. I stated I wanted a ball python. I never asked how much they cost do they go off feed do they need spot on temps or anything. Other people took me wanting a python and started throwing stuff around and started fighting. That is in NO way my fault.
You might want to re-check your statistics on morph prices. Pastel males run roughly $40, and females $75. Yellowbelly's are about the same. A lot of morphs have come down drastically compared to their prices even last year.
You might want to have some fact to back up your claim. This isn't 1995, and Ball Python care has come a long way. Especially since then. Captive hatched and wild caught normals are no longer the normal supply of animals on the market, and most feed ravenously. If they went off feed so easily, they'd go off feed due to changes in your weather during summer, or spring, regardless cage climate. Barometric pressure would play a large part in that. According to your judgment on them, the majority of my hatchling's, juveniles, and sub-adults should be off feed right along-side my adult's. They're not, and they have no supplemental heating right now. What gives? :shrugs:tyflier said:
Yet your looking at one side of the coin. Ball Pythons are specialized, feeding specifically on mammalian prey. Corn snakes, and King snakes are opportunistic hunters that feed on a larger variety of prey. Most want their Ball Pythons to feed on f/t. Why? Feed them live, and there's no problem. There's a reason they have heat pits, and Corns/Kings don't...tyflier said:
Name some, other than these 'increasingly common' feeding issues? I wouldn't say minor, but more along the lines of a range. Do that with any reptile, and you'll see that they all have specific needs. You're not going to keep a Corn Snake like a Ball Python, and you're not going to keep a Ball Python like a Cobra. We're not talking about rocket science, or caring for a touchy species such as Emerald Tree Boa's. We're talking about an animal, rated as one of the best beginner snake species, and for reason.tyflier said:
According to your assumptions, my hatchling's and juveniles should be off feed, and burmating.. Why aren't they? They have no supplemental heating. And there are just too many of them for it to be a simple coincidence, eh?tyflier said:
They don't retreat underground. The majority of their lives are spent in a fossorial life-style. If you really think burrow life is that stable, you should re-check your calculations. Numerous risks include subsiding in a burrow that is too cool, too warm, too humid, not humid enough, infested with parasites such as ticks; etc.
As for Burmating. When it cools, they don't. They breed, and feed. Younger animals feed, while the animals large enough to breed continue to, as they feed. Females build and feed to provide nutrition for their developing eggs, and to survive the exhausting task of reproduction.. Males feed to maintain body weight, from the extreme limits they push their own bodies while feeding.
Females may go off feed naturally, after ovulating to allow her eggs to develop without risk of damage. Guess what? Plenty of other species do as well. Now if you're keeping one as a pet. What is there to worry about?
Daenerys
Mother of Dragons
He also stated in this thread that he wants his threads to be happy, not full of arguments. Trolls wouldn't say something like that.
Nitelion94
I am The Nitelion
Yes I did. I for the life of me can not see why you guys are fighting. The way I see it if someone online buys something you cant stop that. But there is a BIG chance that animal would have a better life if you could focus on helping as much as you do fighting!
Haarstad
Wanna see my snake?
Wow, i know what you mean... That was completely uncalled for. You'd be surprised just how many teens and college students we have here
Daenerys
Mother of Dragons
Exactly. I myself have a total of 32 snakes and a few lizards and not a single one has had any health problems. All of the ones I bought personally I bought as a baby and all are growing into perfect adults. My fiance got all of his snakes while in college as well and all his are perfectly healthy as well. But apparently they all may as well be in a freezer, because I am 19 and can't care for them properly.
josie
New member
Some of the responses in this thread are absolutly rediculous! I do not understand why this site would allow attacks on someone. And to say that a teenager having a pet is equal to that pet being thrown in the freezer ticks me off. Just because someone is a teenager do not mean they cannot be responsible and care for a pet as it should be cared for. I grew up on a farm and had a lot of animals I was responsible for a lot of animals. I have children who are responsible for their pets as well.
Again I say I cannot believe that this site has allowed this type of attacks to continue.
Again I say I cannot believe that this site has allowed this type of attacks to continue.
tyflier
[Insert Witty Commentary]
AndrewH--
I stated that in comparison to cornsnakes and kingsnakes, ball pythons are "picky". I also stated they are more sensitive. Neither of these statements is false. They are, generally and comparatively speaking, true.
Now, if you want top compare BPs to something like ETBs or GTPs or something more difficult, your comparative analysis will change, and BPs will suddenly seem very easy to care for.
Unfortunately, this is a cornsnake site, and MOST of the experience and advice offered on this forum is a comparative analysis to cornsnakes. And comparatively speaking, ball pythons are much more sensitive and picky than cornsnakes.
All of your excuses for AHY they are more picky doesn't alter the fact that they typically are more picky. It just gives them a good reason for being more picky...
I stated that in comparison to cornsnakes and kingsnakes, ball pythons are "picky". I also stated they are more sensitive. Neither of these statements is false. They are, generally and comparatively speaking, true.
Now, if you want top compare BPs to something like ETBs or GTPs or something more difficult, your comparative analysis will change, and BPs will suddenly seem very easy to care for.
Unfortunately, this is a cornsnake site, and MOST of the experience and advice offered on this forum is a comparative analysis to cornsnakes. And comparatively speaking, ball pythons are much more sensitive and picky than cornsnakes.
All of your excuses for AHY they are more picky doesn't alter the fact that they typically are more picky. It just gives them a good reason for being more picky...