Raw Feeders (Dogs)

[MegF.]

exactly. I would pay about $50 a month to feed 4 dogs.....for only 3 it would cost me $147 if I fed raw.....can't afford that...

 

[Nanci]

I just discovered that green tripe is a muscle, not an organ. So I guess I need to buy some more organs- pancreas? That sounds gross. I bet the dogs would love it.

 

[MegF.]

Most raw feeders consider tripe organ meat....

 

[ashleynicole]

I tried to give my dog raw turkey liver and kidneys today and he took it from my hand and then promptly spit it out and stared at me like I tried to feed him dirt... and this dog will eat cooked veggies no problem... so I boiled them and he STILL woildn't touch it. He had NO problem when I gave him cooked turkey meat though...

 

[MegF.]

The only problem is, once you cook it you destroy the value of the meat to a dog. They don't processed the cooked proteins like raw. Sort of what the problem with kibble is. My only picky dog will eat raw turkey, chicken, and pork but nothing else. I had to hide organ meat, she refused deer meat. My other two would eat any meat that was put in front of them.

 

[ashleynicole]

Where is the research to support that cooking the meat destroys the value for dogs? What exactly is it destroying?

 

[MegF.]

It changes the proteins in the meat...it's why it changes color when you cook it. Dogs have a different set of digestive enzymes that don't utilize the cooked meat like raw meat. Same as vegetables...they really aren't able to break down the fibrous portions of vegetables so they don't derive the nutrients in the way we do. There are about a thousand raw feeding groups that give all the facts on the pages...however, be warned....there's even controversy there! The RAW diet feeders believe that dogs should have veggies cut up in the food, pure raw feeders believe that like cats, dogs are pure carnivores and that there's no evidence that wolves or other canids eat vegetable contents of the stomachs of the herbivores they kill. Most of the people I know that feed raw, find the dogs do fine on a pureed veggie/fruit mixture. All however agree that cooking destroys the value of the food. We cook meat because WE feel that it's better.....not necessarily true of a dog or cat though. My cats eat whole raw, uncooked prey and do beautifully. If I could find an affordable raw diet I'd feed that to my dogs. Right now they do well on a high quality grain free diet but if something came up healthwise I would probably go raw with that dog at that time.

 

[MegF.]

People also have the erroneous belief that a dog or cat can catch salmonella from uncooked meat.....they won't. A healthy dog or cat is more than capable of destroying a salmonella bacteria with the powerful acids in their stomachs. Feral dogs like some I've fostered survived on dead deer carcasses...and while they weren't healthy because they had a hard time getting food and had parasites including heartworm, none ever had salmonella.

 

[Kokopelli]

I alternate between
Merrick- geese and yams, grain-less kibble, and a raw-based food called "Bio-dog" manufactured here in Israel.

http://www.biodog.co.il/#!products/cy52

Google translate might be able to translate the ingredients... if not, and there'll be enough interest, I'll translate it over. They have meals based on chicken, turkey, or beef(including inner parts) .

 

[ashleynicole]

I've read all the "websites" and researched raw and barf diets.. but most of their articles are basically blogs with sensationalized ideas with no real research based evidence to back it up. There are groups that believe humans should eat a raw plant based diet, but research shows we can achieve our nutritional requirements many different ways.

On another not... merrick foods made my dog incredibly ill. Actually any grain free food made him sick. I think its because they rely on other binders like potatoes or beans or peas. He is on a limited ingredient lamb and rice kibble and that works for us. I supplement cooked meats and he tolerates that. He won't touch any raw meat except beef which he is allergic to.

I like the idea behind the raw diet but it is definitely not for all dogs.

And cats and dogs can pick up some parasites from raw food. While their gut does kill a lot there are things they can get like trichinosis which luckily is usually a one time infection and they can build immunity.

 

[ashleynicole]

Ive also read some articles that suggest the dogs don't necessarily eat all the organs... that they are sometimes consumed by other scavengers. Some think the wolves eat the stomach contents which I believe since my dog eats his own if he gets sick and eats the cats hairballs too.

 

[Nanci]

The three facebook groups that I really like, with really good files sections are:

The Raw Feeding Community (US)

Rawsome and Holistic! (UK) Janine is a mod

and I've just started reading Rawfeeding Rebels (UK, I think) which I like, so far.

 

[ashleynicole]

It sounds like its going really well for you. I've heard of feeding f/t mice and rats to cats but I fear it would just be so messy... how do people contain the mess? We used to do it with our one dog in his crate because he would drag pieces all over the house to gnaw on them.

 

[Tavia]

It sounds like its going really well for you. I've heard of feeding f/t mice and rats to cats but I fear it would just be so messy... how do people contain the mess? We used to do it with our one dog in his crate because he would drag pieces all over the house to gnaw on them.

This is exactly one of my biggest concerns when I think about feeding raw to either our dogs or especially the cats. That and trying to figure out the right proportions of everything, that constantly confuses me.

 

[Nanci]

My new baby- hopefully it gets here early in December!

I am SO tired of not having any room in the freezer. I don't buy a lot of mice at once, but having to have all the sizes available takes space.

 

[MegF.]

I feed f/t rats to my cats and there's nothing left in general after they eat. Maybe on poop or something which I can wipe up. I feed in the bathroom and put the rat in their bowls. They usually pull them out but it's still not that messy. I usually run the hot water on the rats while the dogs are eating their meals and then feed the cats while the dogs are outside "doin' their business".

 

[Nanci]

I just feed the dogs in their bowls in the kitchen.

 

[ashleynicole]

Nanci they dont drag pieces all over??

For the cats how long does it take them to finish a meal? How do you get them to eat the first whole mouse? They eat the bones and teeth and everything?

 

[Kokopelli]

I've read all the "websites" and researched raw and barf diets.. but most of their articles are basically blogs with sensationalized ideas with no real research based evidence to back it up. There are groups that believe humans should eat a raw plant based diet, but research shows we can achieve our nutritional requirements many different ways.

Well I can't pretend to have gone over the relevant research as well as I should have, but- as kibble is based on meats, and not a few chemicals/preservatives, and since comparing dogs to humans is not really sensible since we're very different evolution-wise, I don't correlate between humans being's need for cooked meat and a dog's...

On another not... merrick foods made my dog incredibly ill. Actually any grain free food made him sick. I think its because they rely on other binders like potatoes or beans or peas. He is on a limited ingredient lamb and rice kibble and that works for us. I supplement cooked meats and he tolerates that. He won't touch any raw meat except beef which he is allergic to.

I like the idea behind the raw diet but it is definitely not for all dogs.

And cats and dogs can pick up some parasites from raw food. While their gut does kill a lot there are things they can get like trichinosis which luckily is usually a one time infection and they can build immunity.

Merrick received top marks in "Thedogadvisor.com" for its ingredients... yes, the transition from a cheaper brand caused a few soft stools initially but that quickly changed.

Another interesting thing to note, which I think speaks volumes FOR raw feeding- "cold turkey" shift from kibble to raw food requires zero preparation or taking gradual steps- has zero digestion issues, stools remain perfect etc- their body respond great to this shift.

Anywhoo, dogs are individuals at the end of the day, no one thing fits all accounts.

The parasites argument, I tend to disagree with- the specific manufacturer we work here is supervised by the ministry of agriculture and veterinary authorities constantly... you receive the food frozen... I feel very safe about it, and have been using it for a year now, along with Merrick, to try and provide "the best of both worlds". If you make sure to bring in meat from reliable sources, parasites shouldn't be a concern.

 

[ashleynicole]

I've also read you shouldn't supplement kibble while feeding raw because the raw meat passes through the system so fast and rhe kibble is so slow to digest it can cause problems to feed both.

I'm well aware of dog food advisor sites and ratings thats why I tried merrick initially.