Are we killing the future market?

[Vinman]

Roy I cant give you points. I tried, good post. We all have different ways of doing things. different stroks for different fokes.

I cant belive no one got banned or the thread got locked either:shrugs::shrugs::shrugs:

 

[Nanci]

I would hope this thread wouldn't get locked for lively, heated discussion. It took a long time for the post in question to be found for all to read.

 

[Roy Munson]

I would hope this thread wouldn't get locked for lively, heated discussion. It took a long time for the post in question to be found for all to read.

I agree. But if the personal and inflammatory stuff can't be left out of the discussion, then a thread-lock is certainly an option. I'm not going to give warnings or suspensions for anything that has happened before THIS post, but all future posts in this thread will be reviewed in strict accordance with the site rules.

 

[wade]

That is your oppion and you are intiled to it. I dont know what future customers you are talking about. I have learned as long as you are honest. It dont make a diferance if they like you are not, so long as you produce great looking animals and stand behind your animals they will sell.

Now as far is your rant is concerned you are falling on deff ears. So take your own advice and crawl into the desert where you belong.

Dear Mr. Munson. I respect you and your wishes. I will make every effort to comply with the rules of this forum. If however I am unable to do so to your satisfaction, please know that I will understand and hold no malice in my heart if you need to slap me down.

Dear Mr. Vinman, thank you for allowing me to have an opinion. We are all aware that you have opinions because you have been beating us over the head with them this week.

The customers I referred to can be found in list form under the heading of Members List for this web site. You are right in saying that customers don’t need to like you. I would agree with you on that. But it is very important that they not dislike you. It is important that they feel you are the kind of person who would listen to any grievance they may have and be reasonable in resolving that grievance. You have demonstrated with great tenacity to lack any of those types of qualities. You don’t seem to be willing to listen to what others are saying and to comment on what they have to say. You have shown us an absolute and complete inability to see middle ground on ever the smallest of things.

I don’t understand why I belong in the desert or why you would imply that is a bad thing. I don’t recall having given any advice to that effect nor do I understand why I couldn’t walk or ride there but would need to crawl. I didn’t feel that my few short sentences in this epic were a rant, I am sorry that you saw them that way.

But bottom line, the fact that what I have to say to you is falling on deaf ears, is exactly my point.

 

[vetusvates]

Dear Mr. Munson. I respect you and your wishes. I will make every effort to comply with the rules of this forum. If however I am unable to do so to your satisfaction, please know that I will understand and hold no malice in my heart if you need to slap me down.

Dear Mr. Vinman, thank you for allowing me to have an opinion. We are all aware that you have opinions because you have been beating us over the head with them this week.

The customers I referred to can be found in list form under the heading of Members List for this web site. You are right in saying that customers don’t need to like you. I would agree with you on that. But it is very important that they not dislike you. It is important that they feel you are the kind of person who would listen to any grievance they may have and be reasonable in resolving that grievance. You have demonstrated with great tenacity to lack any of those types of qualities. You don’t seem to be willing to listen to what others are saying and to comment on what they have to say. You have shown us an absolute and complete inability to see middle ground on ever the smallest of things.

I don’t understand why I belong in the desert or why you would imply that is a bad thing. I don’t recall having given any advice to that effect nor do I understand why I couldn’t walk or ride there but would need to crawl. I didn’t feel that my few short sentences in this epic were a rant, I am sorry that you saw them that way.

But bottom line, the fact that what I have to say to you is falling on deaf ears, is exactly my point.

Can't rep you again Wade, so.....I cannot stand by, silently and not say that you refer in my case, to me myself, at an absolute minimum, on that Members List. Your last two posts are more than eloquent (and at a polar opposite from infantile, I might add), and lay a finger on precisely how far from the original post this has deteriorated into a "my way is better than your way" and "anyone who disagrees can...etc., etc., etc." Many people have been following this thread. ( I hope not too many young new comers, it sets a bad example, in general.) Personally, I'm surprised consequences did not begin after post #186.

 

[ghosthousecorns]

An integral part of my future market is people I interact with on this forum. Many who are nice people and all deserving of respect regardless of their degree of experience or standing on that list of who's who in the corn snake breeder world. Maybe treating potential customers with disrespect is "killing the future market" for yourself!! I know I have clashed with people here before who I would not expect to buy snakes from me, ever. People remember that stuff. Maybe instead of worrying about blacklisting others it's a good thing to worry about ending up on THEIR black lists?

 

[Vinman]

Read the signature part of my posts It says it all. I will produce my animals I chose who gets them . I dont care if people hate you if you have high grade animals they will be sold. So long as I stand behind my animals as I always done and produce little gems they will sell. I don't come on here to be liked or hated. I realy don't care. There will always be people here that like me!!! I come here to keep on top of things and share information and sell my animals and talk about snakes.


You say fly into the sunset I said crawl into the desert. Now you have to admit both are nasty comments. I would have not said mine if you did not make yours . I had no problems with the rest of your post . You have the god given right to a oppion, everyone does. Your post was a good one and you stated your oppion very well ( even though I dont agree with it.) put, but the fly coment there was no need for, since It was your first post to me in this thread. Try to post your first post in a thead without attitude at the end of it it will only get you one back. I think that attitude is what Roy is trying to avoid in this thread.:wavey:

 

[Midnght]

This is a long post.
So I haven't read everything.
But I'd just like to add.


If you want to raise prices then working on decreasing the life span of corns. :idea:

This would at least help when it comes to selling to pet owners.

:dancer:

 

[Eli173]

This is a long post.
So I haven't read everything.
But I'd just like to add.


If you want to raise prices then working on decreasing the life span of corns. :idea:

This would at least help when it comes to selling to pet owners.

:dancer:

Unfortunately reptiles are already considered "disposable pets" by many people and I think that would only make matters worse. A better solution would be a safe and cost effective way of neutering them. Even if it's just the males it would still make a difference.

 

[mike17l]

Unfortunately reptiles are already considered "disposable pets" by many people and I think that would only make matters worse. A better solution would be a safe and cost effective way of neutering them. Even if it's just the males it would still make a difference.

You know, if I could, I would.

Oh snakes, I thought you were talking about the high school freshman that I teach. Oh well.

 

[Vinman]

Unfortunately reptiles are already considered "disposable pets" by many people and I think that would only make matters worse. A better solution would be a safe and cost effective way of neutering them. Even if it's just the males it would still make a difference.

good point, good post

 

[starsevol]

I think it's hard to take someone seriously who appears to be suffering from delusions of grandeur......

 

[ForkedTung]

"Please. You are all undercutting peasants and besides you are not from NYC. I would not sell you a rat turd, thanks your hero"

 

[mike17l]

Alright, as the OP, I have the ability to delete any off topic posts, so lets bring this back on topic. Here is my original post:

I know times are hard and people need to pay bills and snakes are not selling, but are we killing the future market for medium to high end corns? In a recent ad, a snake that would have been $1000 only 8 months ago. Now it is $200? another ad, has a pair of snakes (ultramel lav and het) for $200 as well, 8 months ago, that pair would have been much nearer to $700.

So, what are we telling the buying public? Are we telling them that all you have to do is wait 8 months and then you can get any morph you want for $200 or less?

If wee drop prices now, when times are hard, when it gets better and the market goes up, what will people expect? Will they expect to pay $1000 for a $1000 snake, or will they still expect to pay $200 for a $1000 snake?

So are we killing the future market? Will we ever be able to hope to sell an animal at $1000 or more?

This was never supposed to be about who has and who hasn't crashed the market, or about the known drop in price over many seasons. This was supposed to be about what we are telling the public when an animal actually sells for $1000 at the beginning of a season and is advertised publicly for $200 less than 6 months later at the end of the season.

Are we telling the public "wait six months and prices will be substantially less"? Are we telling buyers that even though they payed top dollar for an animal in May/June they could have saved $800 if they waited till Nov/Dec?



Note: I'm not really going to delete any off topic posts, they have been very entertaining. :dancer:

 

[diamondlil]

For some people the chance to get new genetic combos as early as possible will be worth paying the higher prices. Other people will prefer to wait until the morph or combo is more common and more affordable for them. There's no way of freezing prices when there will be others selling the same genetics next season, IMO.
I liked Rich's explanation of how he changes his prices up or down according to supply and demand for each morph, made sense to me.

 

[Vinman]

Mike the Op you made is like a dead end. It answer's it self. The message your post says is dont invest in high dollar animals because the market is unstable. Thats the message. That is the answer. I think you know that is the answer as well as I do. Ok now that would be the end of the thread so how do we make it better would be the next step in the thread.

 

[Drizzt80]

This was supposed to be about what we are telling the public when an animal actually sells for $1000 at the beginning of a season and is advertised publicly for $200 less than 6 months later at the end of the season.

I think the question needs to be asked "Was that snake truly worth $1000 to begin with?" Obviously not if the price can't be maintained. I've always believed there has to be a finite number of people that can simply afford that price . . . regardless of the current economy. :shrugs:

Note: I'm not really going to delete any off topic posts, they have been very entertaining. :dancer:

Glad I could oblige! I know I had fun.

D80

 

[Drizzt80]

For some people the chance to get new genetic combos as early as possible will be worth paying the higher prices.

And they take the risk of not getting a return on their investment. That's life! To come back and complain of getting undercut is ridiculous.

I liked Rich's explanation of how he changes his prices up or down according to supply and demand for each morph, made sense to me.

Definitely. Common sense, not price fixing as "one" has suggested.

D80

 

[ForkedTung]

I think the question needs to be asked "Was that snake truly worth $1000 to begin with?" Obviously not if the price can't be maintained. I've always believed there has to be a finite number of people that can simply afford that price . . . regardless of the current economy. :shrugs:

D80

Good point Brent, It's only a $1,000 snake as long as someone is willing to pay $1,000 for it. My guess would be that for the most part, those days are likely gone other than very striking, brand new genes etc... ( the Tessera would be one of those though).

 

[Vinman]

mike17l
I remember when butters hit the seen. RZ could have produced tons of the morph. But he did not . He only produced a limitted numbers of animals and promised investors that the price would not drop for a few years. I dont know if Rich Z doing remembers it. He did do it and kept the 300 dollar price for 2 to 3 years.

Janine, Cross your fingers this year. I hope things go well like to send you conmorps and Pual more stuff