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Controversial topic?

It does seem a lot of people around my age and even older do this. Honestly I enjoy my animals because they are what interest me. When I come home and have nothing to do they are something that I enjoy that keeps me busy. The thing about reptile forums though they are a place for people to share their interest in reptiles, show off what they have, admire what other people have, and help people who need advise. Like I could go and show my best friend or my girlfriend a super striped okeetee creamsicle ultramel lavender blood red with a high white sides (is this even possible? lol) and they'd be like cool but really to him its just another snake. I could go on here though and have people who know what it is, make nice comments about it and share what they thought and appreciate what you have. The hobby is lots of fun and you don't need other peoples opinions on this but unless you have friends who share the same interest a forum is good so you can have other people appreciate what you do.
 
LOL if I based keeping corns on my popularity on the internet or how impressed other people are by what I have, I would have stopped keeping them a LONG time ago.
 
Well here are a few quotes I want to expand on.
Tula_Montage said:
I personally believe in buying what you desire without giving a crap about what anyone else will say or think. Heck, you need to look at that animal for the next 15-20 years so why not enjoy what you buy right?
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Problem is, lets take someone who is between 15-25 (this is where I see happening the most) who really wants a snake. Well they get these snakes and the day of purchase, they are going to keep this snake and its for them. Well, as time goes on, either life takes over, college or the real world and we find them not so interested in their pets. They tend to give them up for adoption or we find them on Craigs list for sale here in the States.
Elle, at one point you were like this as well. As you stated those hoggies were not for you and I know your first time as a herp keeper before you moved, you had to get rid most of your animals. Now in your case there was nothing wrong with it, you had to move and you went to bigger and better things. But here I see to many young people who bring in these boas and large pythons to rescues due to not wanting them any more. These are the impulse buyers. We all have seen it in one way or another. If you are in this hobby til death, you will see it often.


WHY oh why are people so highly influenced by what other people have?! Forums to me, sometimes seem like a big ole mass of snakie peer pressure!
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Yeah, this is another problem. I see it alot here at CS and other forums. I see people buying snakes to breed and hopefully sell down the line. Well guess what, what these people are doing are marketing themselves so that way when they do breed their animals, there is a demand and here at CS.com there is ready list of buyers.
Dont worry, I am not knocking people, heck, i have inquired and I am on some lists here for animals. But I have seen a rash of animals appear in peoples collections and its like waves. I think in the last 6 months the most popular new herp to pick up is the Crested Gecko. This site wasn't the only one were people were posting pictures of their new lizards.

Gah, i am rambling now..
 
tricksterpup said:
Elle, at one point you were like this as well. As you stated those hoggies were not for you and I know your first time as a herp keeper before you moved, you had to get rid most of your animals. Now in your case there was nothing wrong with it, you had to move and you went to bigger and better things. But here I see to many young people who bring in these boas and large pythons to rescues due to not wanting them any more. These are the impulse buyers. We all have seen it in one way or another. If you are in this hobby til death, you will see it often.
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Would just like to clarify that I had all my snakes fostered out for a few months during a messy break up and got them ALL back except for the 3 boas and a couple of corns which my ex decided to keep. His money, his snakes something like that. I miss my boas so damn much :( I have tried for the last 2 years to get them back, but no joy.
 
Yea I do see it too, I have seen it mostly with new keepers who have disposable income, rather than by age. They can afford the really nice snakes, the ones that are out of reach of many of us who go with hets instead. They post pics of their expensive snakes in their expensive racks, get a lot of oohs and aaahhhs and rep points, and a few years later I see this big collection for sale ad. It would get to me more if it wasn't just human nature, just like having a nicer car or watch. "Keeping up with the Joneses" and all that. In the end when these collections do go up for sale, many people profit by getting adults someone else has already done the work of raising for reduced prices...
 
When I was a teen and young 20 something...

LONG before there was an Internet, I wanted nothing more than a giant snake (or 2 or 3...). And I DID research them, and THOUGHT I knew everything there was to know about them. By the time I was around 20 or 21, I had a couple of Burmese, a 14' retic, several boas...can't remember what else. A few of those snakes, I actually kept until I was around 30 or so. But eventually, the huge poops and my sore back and shoulders got the best of me. And I came to my senses and realized that I really didn't need something that huge!

But there was just no way I could have predicted, when 15 - 20 years old, what my life would be like in 5 or 10 years (or even longer), or what I would really love by then. Things change WAY TOO MUCH at that age. All I would ask of people in that age range is to realize that things WILL change, and to research, ask questions, and think carefully before any major purchases or life changes. That is all it is fair to ask of somebody during that tumultuous time of life. There is just too little life experience, and changes happen so quickly, that you can't expect to accurately predict your life, feelings, tastes, or much of anything else 10 years hence, at such a tender age (heck, you might have 6 or 8 kids by then - who knows?).
 
If I couldn’t show off my collection on the internet I would still own just as many snakes. On the other hand if people didn't show off their collections I'm sure my collection would look vastly different. The pictures and posts of others show me all that is out there, educates me and allows me to select exactly what I want. Otherwise I’d be purchasing from pet shops or adds using fancy names and hyped up descriptions.
 
I have always bought what I liked regardless of their popularity, but sure there are those who buy certain species because everyone else has them, or they think they are going to hit the jackpot breeding them. I doubt I will ever breed snakes, but I know I will own a few more as my forever pets.
 
Personally, I would only buy snakes that I like, and that were a good fit for me. I find most of the snakes I see on this site beautiful, but I don't think I'll ever be getting a burm or BCC or any hot even though I find them gorgeous. As far as corn morphs, and other types of snakes, I suppose I'm mostly influenced by my personaly preference for how they look. Though I wouldn't jump into something without doing some major research first.
 
Great thought-provoking post, elle!

I only have one snake at the moment, and although I know I'll get more and do realize the commitment in terms of not only money and care, but options as I get older. Not everyone loves snakes as much as I do (my family reminds me of that daily), so I've made an effort to understand that it may limit me in terms of living situations and travelling in the future.

When I get a new pet, I try to estimate the *lifetime* cost of the animal. My rabbit for example, had a start-up cost of a $250 + $150 neuter + $240 maintenance for the year. Now multiply that by 10 years of living, and one little bunny could easily run me over $2800....and over 2,000 hours of cleaning.
 
I'm with the owning for myself group......
If I was trying to impress, I'd be photographing and posting a lot more...
I still have things you lot have never seen, TBH, no-one has ever seen some of the things we have..... The reason, I don't have a story to add to the pics..... LOL
I only post things I am trying to make my name in... ie the carpets, or if I take a really good pic of something......
 
If you listened to my mom tell it I was always playing with snakes but I never had one as a pet until 1998. The girl I was dating had three corns that just fascinated me but I refused to buy one until she let me watch her feed them because if I couldn’t watch it eat what good would I have been as keeper. Six months later I was lucky enough to buy my third corn from Dwight Good who turned out to be my mentor on all things snake like.

In 2000 I hatched out my first clutch from normal het snow X snow and watching the eggs pip addicted me for life. In 2005 I had over 250 snakes in my spare bedroom. The internet only helped in connecting me to likeminded people to discuss laws, husbandry, and to drool over someone’s lone keeper from a clutch. I started out on the KS forums and was one of the first to migrate here when Rich opened the doors. I am not sure if I would have had over 250 snakes if it was not for the internet because so many of them came from breeders I met here but Kentucky does have two reptile shows so maybe I would have bought them there instead.
 
In short, yes I would. The #1 reason I own all my snakes is because I have been fascinated by them for as long as I can remember. (and my buddy keeps giving me more!) No matter if I sell a snake or whatever, their welfare is always top priority for me. The other thing I get from non-snake people is they wonder why I'll keep snakes that bite. I have to explain it's natural behavior, usually I've done something wrong, and it doesn't make them any less cool or lovable to me. Just requires some different methods of dealing with and handling them. If the day ever comes where I stop keeping my snakes because I love them, or breeding them becomes strictly a monetary thing for me (which I can't see happening), that will be the day when I stop collecting as it's not fair to the animals.
 
"...The other thing I get from non-snake people is they wonder why I'll keep snakes that bite..."

Yes, that is strange to me, too. My cat scratches me fairly often, only because I let him play too roughly - my fault! I am SUPPOSED to be smarter than the cat, lol! And when I had dogs, I used to wrestle with them and would sometimes get small bites or scratches from their teeth or nails. Again, my fault. Of course, the snakes aren't "playing" like cats and dogs would. But it is all natural behavior, and all generally correctable by the "smart" (sometimes, anyway!) human behaving properly.

I would NEVER get rid of my cat (or not own cats in the future) because he scratched me, and neither would most cat owners.

Just another example of emotional response from lack of experience or research.
 
well isn't that kind of like asking "did you have children just so you could show them off to friends and family, and post pictures on internet sites for all to ooh and aah at?" lol and in a way it's the same thing because i know many of us treat our snakes as our children!!

but like many others i only get the animals i have for my own personal love of the animals. i love taking care of them and feeding them and cleaning them and providing them with a great home. i love watching they way they move, watching them drink, watching all their curious little habits. it's just my hobby i guess! some people have mountain biking or drawing, i have snakes and photography!

actually, i don't think i would be NEARLY as into photography if it weren't for my animals. actually you are right elle, this site HAS inspired me to buy something...my DSLR!!!! because after seeing how much BETTER and how much MORE IN CONTROL i could be over my pictures, purely from seeing photos posted on this site, i felt i had outgrown my digital point and shoot.

sorry this was just a little ramble, mostly me typing out loud.
 
Katia I agree, there were so many people that inspired me to get into DSLR photography as I just didn't have enough control on my point and shoot either. Katie particularly inspired me tremendously with her stunning shots of purdy snakes!
 
Well

For me it started out as having a pair of snakes as pets,then they bred and had some cool babys! Well ended up selling those and thought it would be fun and exciting to breed them and sell them to people for pets. Later did more research got internet saw all the new morphs and decided to get some of the new morphs. Grew out and bred those.Then decided to make some of my own combinations,to produce some I never seen before,it was alot of work I thought ,but decided to go through with it.When the hets I grew out were finally big enough to breed and bred those together watching the eggs hatch was probably one of the most exciting times of my life! To see a morph hatch out that you never seen before is something I wont forget. That fueled the fire to try to continue to make new morphs.Learning so much going through it all.One thing I can say is its not for everyone and to be able to, you must have a love and fascination for reptiles! Back to the topic I have seen people with alot of money buy high dollar morphs only to sell there collection a couple years down the road. I dont think people will be buying snakes now though just to show off the way the economy is! ;)
 
HA I know what you mean Stephen. I'm forking out £150 for spotted pythons. To me last year that wouldn't have made much of a dent (heck I must have shelled out a couple of grand on snakes last year, all cash no credit). That definitely won't be happening this year.

I saw someone recently sell their entire collection off... high end animals, chondros etc. Now they are snapping up high end boas like no tomorrow. I wonder what their "poor circumstances" were for selling in the first place? Pshhhh.
 
stephen said:
For me it started out as having a pair of snakes as pets,then they bred and had some cool babys! Well ended up selling those and thought it would be fun and exciting to breed them and sell them to people for pets. Later did more research got internet saw all the new morphs and decided to get some of the new morphs. Grew out and bred those.Then decided to make some of my own combinations,to produce some I never seen before,it was alot of work I thought ,but decided to go through with it.When the hets I grew out were finally big enough to breed and bred those together watching the eggs hatch was probably one of the most exciting times of my life! To see a morph hatch out that you never seen before is something I wont forget. That fueled the fire to try to continue to make new morphs.Learning so much going through it all.One thing I can say is its not for everyone and to be able to, you must have a love and fascination for reptiles! Back to the topic I have seen people with alot of money buy high dollar morphs only to sell there collection a couple years down the road. I dont think people will be buying snakes now though just to show off the way the economy is! ;)
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Stephen, I know what you mean here. Back in 2002, before I had ever been to a herp forum, I was helping out a freind. He had to move and had to sell off his snake collection. I took his 3 favorites for a year and a half. 2 were normals. He said I could breed them and sell the babies to pay for their boarding.....I bred them and ended up with an amel, a normal, and 2 bloodreds and a fire! I had never ever seen a bloodred or a fire irl before, just pictures! I kept all 3 and couldn't stop smiling for months. One of the BEST summers I've ever had!
 
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