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Golddust X Creamsicle

R

ReptilesRevealed

New member
I have been searching for calculators that would give me this answer but haven't found one that could.

I know I know that neither are really a corn snake but hey I am playing here.

I am guess I would get amels and ultramels Het for the other genes involved. but just wanted to see if even that was the case.

Thanks for you input.

Scott
 
You won't get Amels, because Amel is a pure Corn morph. You can use morph calculators and substitute Amel for Creamsicle, but where you get an Amel result, you need to convert that back to Creamsicle.

For the record, there's no blanket agreement that GoldDusts are hybrids.
 
bitsy said:
You won't get Amels, because Amel is a pure Corn morph.
Click to expand...

Actually, you will get Amels out of this breeding. Creamsicles are the result of the combine of Amel Corn X Emoryi Rat.
A Creamsicle is basically a Amel variation such as a Candycane or Reverse Okeetee.

The breeding of a Creamsicle X Golddust the clutch, in theory, would result in:

1/2 Amel (varitation due to Emoryi) het Caramel
1/2 Ultramel (variation due to Emoryi) het Caramel

Walter
:crazy02:BOUT' CORNS !!
 
Walter Smith said:
Creamsicles are the result of the combine of Amel Corn X Emoryi Rat.
Click to expand...
Making Creamsicles hybrids.

A Creamsicle is basically a Amel variation such as a Candycane or Reverse Okeetee.
Click to expand...
No. "Amels" derived from Creamsicles, are Creamsicles.

A Creamsicle is NOT a variation of the pure Corn Amel. A Creamsicle is a hybrid. Small wonder people question the ancestry of captive-bred Corns. People selling Creamsicles as Amels scarcely inspires confidence.

An Amel by definition is a pure Corn.

Therefore no offspring of a Creamsicle can be an Amel as they won't be pure Corn.

Adding "variation" to the name makes no difference. It's at best obfuscatory and at worst, deliberately misleading.
 
bitsy said:
You won't get Amels, because Amel is a pure Corn morph. You can use morph calculators and substitute Amel for Creamsicle, but where you get an Amel result, you need to convert that back to Creamsicle.

For the record, there's no blanket agreement that GoldDusts are hybrids.
Click to expand...

Actually, the first commercially-available-to-the-public candycanes back in the early 80's were f2's from amel emoryi X gutatta. If you dig down deep enough there's a couple posts here and there about that.

click---> Let me do the searching for you. <---click
 
ReptilesRevealed said:
I have been searching for calculators that would give me this answer but haven't found one that could.

I know I know that neither are really a corn snake but hey I am playing here.

I am guess I would get amels and ultramels Het for the other genes involved. but just wanted to see if even that was the case.

Thanks for you input.

Scott
Click to expand...

Scott, if you mix up amel, regardless of whether it is the amel gene which was taken from emoryi stock, or the amel gene which was acquired from wild caught pure gutatta (and they are not the same kind of amel gene, as the first pairings of amel X amel between the two subspecies produced normal/classics)...
anyways, caramel+cremesicle+hypo-or-one of the things called Ultra, you will get some brighter more vibrantly colored offspring. But if you breed the cremesicle too far out into regular cornsnake stock, then the cremesicle attributes/colors/markers begin to disappear and you'll get away from what I think you're shooting for, the doubling up of color intensities. I have a few such critters around here containing cremesicle/ultra/hypo/butter. Just holding on to them to move them into kingcorn or milkcorn hybrid programs.
 
Thanks for the info....I am definitely not trying to get a pure corn as I know both really aren't. I am if anything playing with genes. And for some reason my Gold dust female wants nothing to do with my Gold dust male....so I had this other male Striped cream and I thought what the heck.

S60000043.jpg
 
bitsy said:
Making Creamsicles hybrids.


No. "Amels" derived from Creamsicles, are Creamsicles.

A Creamsicle is NOT a variation of the pure Corn Amel. A Creamsicle is a hybrid. Small wonder people question the ancestry of captive-bred Corns. People selling Creamsicles as Amels scarcely inspires confidence.

An Amel by definition is a pure Corn.

Therefore no offspring of a Creamsicle can be an Amel as they won't be pure Corn.

Adding "variation" to the name makes no difference. It's at best obfuscatory and at worst, deliberately misleading.
Click to expand...

LOL.......ya gotta love it.

Amelanistic: Abbreviated as Amel, refers to a snake with a total absence of Melanin.


Regardless of what it's combined with, an AMEL will have red eyes, which will be 50% of the outcome of the said breeding.

A Butter is a AMEL variation of Caramel
A Candycane is a AMEL variation of Miami Phase
A Opal is a AMEL variation of Lavender
A Creamsicle is a AMEL variation of Rootbeer (Corn X Emoryi).................all having red eyes.


The term AMEL by definition does NOT mean "Pure Corn".............sorry.

Walter
:crazy02:BOUT' CORNS !!
 
airenlow said:
And the trade name for Amel rootbeer is??? Come on, we know you love your trade names...
Click to expand...

Yeah, Creamsicle.......

No matter how many times you say Creamsicle, it's still a variation of AMEL

Bye Bye now :wavey:

Walter
:crazy02:BOUT' CORNS !!
 
Walter Smith said:
Yeah, Creamsicle.......

No matter how many times you say Creamsicle, it's still a variation of AMEL

Bye Bye now :wavey:

Walter
:crazy02:BOUT' CORNS !!
Click to expand...

No, it's not.
Amel is a pure corn.
Cream is a mutt.
Pure and simple.
Cream is a variation of a corn and rat mix. It is not a morph.
Amel is a morph.

Not confidence inspiring stuff here......
 
Sorry, but I've got to side with Walter on this one.

Amelanism is a genetic trait, REGARDLESS of what the gene is exhibited within concerning the species, genera, hybrid, intergrade, or whatever. "Amel" is just short hand in the context of corn snakes for "Amelanistic Corn Snake". Just as "Amel" in the context of Burmese Pythons would indicate an "Amelanistic Burmese Python.

"Amel" by itself doesn't indicate anything pure or impure, and actually nothing else, for that matter, about the animal itself that the genetic trait exhibits itself within.

In my opinion, of course.
 
From Sean's website @ VMS: Definition of "Creamsicle"

Homozygous for Amelanism, a recessive trait, and influenced by intergrade effects

Walter
:crazy02:BOUT' CORNS !!
 
From Chuck Pritzel's 2011 edition Cornsnake Morph Guide: (page 98) Definition of "Creamsicle"

"It is specifically applied to AMELANISTIC corn/emoryi individuals. The pictured example is AMELANISTIC.

Walter
:crazy02:BOUT' CORNS !!
 
Still, I consider someone selling a creamsicle as an amel very unethical.
They are not interchangable.
 
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