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Mystery Ghost *female*

MichellesCreatures

MichellesCreatures

New member
Just thought I would start a new thread since people might not see these pics if I posted at the end of the other one! Just wanted to show the pics I took today of the female I have from Carol. Some of these came out a little dark, but the closeup of her head shows the best of her color.
keysghost.jpg


keysghost1.jpg


keysghost2.jpg
 
this snake looks like it has emoryi to me this snake is realated to yours this is carols photo. look at the crown in your snake and carols. look at th small saddles and the side pattren.I'm not saying is a emoryi cross for sure but it looks like one and the rosy in the mix would bring out that trait in a emoryi cross. It can also be the gene changing the pattren . Motley, blood, stripe, all change color and pattren. but its pattren looks like a emoryi cross. vinny
 

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Personally I think it looks like a pure corn. The head and coloration leads me to believe it has some charcoal influence. The purplish hue is a key sign. The only other thing that I could think of is maybe some of the bandedness is showing through in these snakes. Are any of the parents banded or from banded lines? Maybe its just a incubation fluke....that happend twice:)
 
charlie look at the pattren that pattren is not markings of a corn. if you read the other therad that carol posted you would have seen I said looked like a charcoal. just because it maybe a charcoal dosen't meen that it cant be a emoryi cross banding is a large saddle it has no side pattren. the side pattren and the saddles dont mach up and there are to many side blotches and to thin.

:-offtopic by the thanks for stiffing me last year on the snake that you had me hold for a few months that you never took and left me hanging.you could of called. you seem like a cool person :shrugs:
 
Yes, I read the other post and saw that you had already mentioned that you thought it could be a charcoal. Carol said that the grandparents were pure corns. Just because the pattern looks like an emoryi cross doesn't mean it is. She said that both parents were from reputable breeders and doubted that it had any other blood in it. Obviously it is a fluke....pattern wise. I was just putting my thoughts in.

In this post...there is a corn that has the similar pattern. I think it could be the upper keys influence since Carol said that her male was 1/4 upper keys. If I am correct...these two snakes are siblings?
 
i think it's either got emoryi in it, or possibly even bairdi. maybe it's just me, but it looks like it's got more saddles than your typical corn.

it's pretty, no matter what it is.
 
If you look at the end of post #4, I will quote myself ; It can also be the gene changing the pattren . Motley, blood, stripe, all change color and pattren. but its pattren looks like a emoryi cross. vinny
 
These guys are from pure stock from reputable breeders. Yes they are siblings, and yes there is banded lineage in thier background. It is just an extreme form of banding/high saddle count. Just like Milksnake Phases are an extreme form of low saddle count.

I was considering the other day that maybe these are just Charcoals and there is a non-compatable Hypo situation at work. But if that is so... Why the red? It can't be denied that the red coming through at the base of the saddles is strange. Only time will tell.

I agree with Rich, it's very silly to get upset over anything, especially when we have no clue what we are dealing with.
 
I think said it first telling not to get heated and lets have fun with it. you never know what a codomint gene will do.
 
corn? or Emory cross?

Hello All,

I agree with the Vinman. I have 1.2 albino emory, 1.1 Hypo emory and they have the same head style and very similar saddles. It's a good thing though.........believe me.



Franklin
 
Well, another point would be, I have never seen anything with emoyri blood (even diluted) that could ever produce this color red. This is a pic of the "mystery ghost's" mother. Dad is just as red.
 

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I'm not saying that it isa 100% emoryi cross I can tell you that it looks like one . the fact is that a lot of miami blood has emory blood in it, the loves been doing it for years. and look at all the snakes they produced . You can not go on color alone. their are pleanty of miami with nice red saddles dont tell me that none of them dont have emoryi in them they been crossed into the strain for to many years now. . In one of my past post, I posted about a guy who lives in upstate NY who had corns that were from wild parents at the white plans show about 10 years ago. that were super gray with bright red saddles they were only 5 dolars he had about 50 ton 60 babies. I asked him about the stock at first he kinda beat around the bush. and then he told me what happend. I have wild caught gray rats and wild corns together in a large cage. and I dont keep track of who breeds with who . the all look like corns and the are all ratsnakes what is the diffrance.
How many of thoese snakes got breed back to pure corns and where are their desendants today? In some pure corn stock or so called pure stock.
 
I am not aware of my Miamis having any emoryi blood in them at all. I have not tried to keep my Miami lines locality specific as I have with okeetees. That is why the occasional lav, hypo, or amel may pop out from time to time - because of projects I have done with those morphs. But not with emoryi x Miami.

You may be thinking of the fact that my candycane founding stock started with light amels, alb. okeetees, a light background colored creamsicle, and some Miami phase animals. So there has to be a small amount of creamsicle blood left in the candycane line, but not the Miami. The only candycane ever used in my Miami project was one that came from Rich, and I am quite sure that would not have emoryi in it!

BTW Carol, that is one nice looking "mom" in your photo!
 
It "LOOKS" like it has emoryi in it. However I believe carol that its pure. There is something wierd going on in that corn, its changing color and pattern. I really like it, I hope it proves out genetic....They are really cool looking.

LukeH
 
I wouldn't mind that much about the red carol. As you statet, some kind of weird Hypo, or Hypo in general, can reactivate red tones in the snake, as we see in pastels. Also lavenders, grey as adults, can by very colorfull as a juvie or in connection with Hypo.

As I stated in the other thread, the look screams emoryi and I would love to have that pattern in pure corns. Imho, the parents and the source for the grandparents make me think this is pure corn. May there be enough emoryi integrated in the lines, but why should this pop up after 2 (or even more) generations in THAT way?!?!?
Look at the creams, nearly none of them has that strong emoryi pattern look after a few generations.
 
Emory's look . . .

Menhir said:
I wouldn't mind that much about the red carol. As you statet, some kind of weird Hypo, or Hypo in general, can reactivate red tones in the snake, as we see in pastels. Also lavenders, grey as adults, can by very colorfull as a juvie or in connection with Hypo.

As I stated in the other thread, the look screams emoryi and I would love to have that pattern in pure corns. Imho, the parents and the source for the grandparents make me think this is pure corn. May there be enough emoryi integrated in the lines, but why should this pop up after 2 (or even more) generations in THAT way?!?!?
Look at the creams, nearly none of them has that strong emoryi pattern look after a few generations.
Click to expand...

I agree those snakes "scream" Emory's rat. One of them is virtually identical to some I've seen, but I know that I have never bred Emory's into those lines and know the guy I got the founding animals from and he is very honest.

I also can't imagine that a pure Emory's or anything similar to it could be resurrected after all this time if indeed it is in the 'roots'. I've been breeding creamsicle for many years and have always seen this go the other way. If you offered me thousands of dollars to get a creamsicle line back to Emory's without the influence of new Emory's blood, I'd tell you to keep your $$. I've never seen the slightest tendency towards that.

Regarding SMR credentials. I've personally only bred Emory's rat to corn two times. Once was when I bred the albino Emory's to the albino corn gene to see if they were allelic. Only did that one once. The second time was when I bred an Emory's to a ghost corn. Only one egg hatched and I still have it. I've never bred it to a corn OR Emory's rat. All the creamsicles I have here were bred by other people and I have just been breeding them to other creamsicles.

One last thought. Corn snake ranges overlap with Emory's in more than one state. It would be a rare occurrence, but it's possible that corn snakes caught in those intergradation zones could have been used and subsequently introduced their genes to corn snake lines in captivity. I personally have never had any of those that I'm aware of.
 
I just want to make it clear I not saying that it is a emory cross it's just the pattren looks so much like emory that why I question it. I agree with Don and what he posted at the end of his post Quote ; One last thought. Corn snake ranges overlap with Emory's in more than one state. It would be a rare occurrence, but it's possible that corn snakes caught in those intergradation zones could have been used and subsequently introduced their genes to corn snake lines in captivity. I personally have never had any of those that I'm aware of. Don I'm sure this has happend more than a few times.

Kathy, thanx for clearing things up. So I will have to say if candy canes that were produced long ago with emoryi where are theid dessendants? answer ; mixed in the so called pure corn stock. how many people have crossed their corns with emoryi blood and not said a thing. I give credit to kathy she tell the truth llike it

Also I talked to Rich, he told me that only the anerys have this pattren not he normals and thease come from pure rosy stock. the parents that produces the anerys came from a grived W.C. fem. rosy
 
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