-
Hello!
Either you have not registered on this site yet, or you are registered but have not logged in. In either case, you will not be able to use the full functionality of this site until you have registered, and then logged in after your registration has been approved.
Registration is FREE, so please register so you can participate instead of remaining a lurker....
Please be certain that the location field is correctly filled out when you register. All registrations that appear to be bogus will be rejected. Which means that if your location field does NOT match the actual location of your registration IP address, then your registration will be rejected.
Sorry about the strictness of this requirement, but it is necessary to block spammers and scammers at the door as much as possible.
She died... and now I feel like a total failure
- Thread starter Hypancistrus
- Start date
desertanimal
2003 UB313
Flagg said:
From Mirriam-Webster:
argument: 2 a : a reason given in proof or rebuttal b : discourse intended to persuade
I'm not trying to start one. We've already been having one.
Flagg said:
Dogged, detail-oriented, devout disciples of logic do. But you are right--that it doesn't matter, I concede.
Last edited:
That story makes me really sad. My little anery is sick and my worst fear is that I'll wake up one morning and find her all lifeless.
Sometimes these things happen. Don't be so hard on yourself. You're next snake should do just fine. I really hope that you start feeling better. And good luck for next time.
Sometimes these things happen. Don't be so hard on yourself. You're next snake should do just fine. I really hope that you start feeling better. And good luck for next time.
jazzgeek
The Rule Of Thirds.
"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to desertanimal again."
regards,
jazz
(another devout disciple of logic)
Hypancistrus - sorry for your loss, especially with the anticipation I've seen from your previous posts. But, as stated by others, Susan will take care of you. Her integrity and ethics are among the best here, and I've yet to be a customer of hers.
regards,
jazz
(another devout disciple of logic)
Hypancistrus - sorry for your loss, especially with the anticipation I've seen from your previous posts. But, as stated by others, Susan will take care of you. Her integrity and ethics are among the best here, and I've yet to be a customer of hers.
kathylove
Pragmatic & Logical
As a customer, you can't be expected to know all of the ins and outs of the shipping business. So don't feel badly if you had arranged for somebody to be there and they "left their post" - that was their fault, not yours. The snake may have already been overheated in the truck as well. You have no way to find that out one way or the other. But there are ways to avoid that scenario next time.
As a shipper, I always assume that my customers know nothing about shipping and I highly suggest that they pick up their shipment at FedEx during hot or cold weather. I also check to see if 10:30 a.m. delivery is available at their location. If you are in a small town, it may not be available. Then it is even more important for you to pick it up if the weather is hot.
AFAIK, all of us have reptile waivers that state we can only ship to a business address or have it held for pick up at FedEx. They have allowed us to slide by with delivery to a home business, but that opens the door for this kind of mistake to happen. As far as I can tell, if FedEx has EVER delivered to a particular address before, they will assume they can leave packages at the door forever more. It is just not worth the risk, unless you are going to sit on the front porch to wait for them. Even then, the risk is that they might not find the right place at the right time. It is much easier for them to find a business address, and even less risk for them to keep it at the FedEx office.
I would guess that it was actually a cold pack in your shipment. Unfortunately, by the time they are really needed the next day, they have long since warmed up. But they can still provide a little thermal mass to delay the inevitable heating up during the day. Better than nothing.
I really push for customers to pick up at FedEx or at least take delivery at a regular business address where the FedEx people can walk right in the door to a receptionist or sales person. Much less room for mistakes that way.
There is no way for you to know everything when you first start. You will make some mistakes along the way (even after years of keeping and breeding). The important thing is to learn from each mistake, don't repeat it, and pass the knowledge on to others.
As a shipper, I always assume that my customers know nothing about shipping and I highly suggest that they pick up their shipment at FedEx during hot or cold weather. I also check to see if 10:30 a.m. delivery is available at their location. If you are in a small town, it may not be available. Then it is even more important for you to pick it up if the weather is hot.
AFAIK, all of us have reptile waivers that state we can only ship to a business address or have it held for pick up at FedEx. They have allowed us to slide by with delivery to a home business, but that opens the door for this kind of mistake to happen. As far as I can tell, if FedEx has EVER delivered to a particular address before, they will assume they can leave packages at the door forever more. It is just not worth the risk, unless you are going to sit on the front porch to wait for them. Even then, the risk is that they might not find the right place at the right time. It is much easier for them to find a business address, and even less risk for them to keep it at the FedEx office.
I would guess that it was actually a cold pack in your shipment. Unfortunately, by the time they are really needed the next day, they have long since warmed up. But they can still provide a little thermal mass to delay the inevitable heating up during the day. Better than nothing.
I really push for customers to pick up at FedEx or at least take delivery at a regular business address where the FedEx people can walk right in the door to a receptionist or sales person. Much less room for mistakes that way.
There is no way for you to know everything when you first start. You will make some mistakes along the way (even after years of keeping and breeding). The important thing is to learn from each mistake, don't repeat it, and pass the knowledge on to others.
Hypancistrus
New member
Kathy,
Thank you for your thoughts. I was tremendously POed at my father for walking down to my grandmothers house- even though, as I said, she literally lives 100 feet down the road. But what can I do? He doesn't keep animals, and he doesn't understand how even a few minutes on a porch can be horrible.
Again, there's a lot that I know now that I didn't know two days ago. Rest assured, that any future animal shipments will go to FedEx and be picked up at 9 AM. Regardless. I have the FedEx delivery email, and she was delivered at 2:14, and I was home at 2:15 according to my car clock. So she can't have sat on the porch that long, and I really think at that point it didn't matter, because she had been in the non-climate controlled FedEx truck since 9 or 10 that morning! That's at least 4 hours in high 90 degree heat! While she was in shed!
I guess it was just too much for her.
But thank you Kathy, for your advice. I read your book cover to cover, twice, in anticipation of my babies arrival. I've been so excited about her- I've told everyone and now I feel like a real moron.
Thanks to everyone else who has provided advice on the shipping so I don't make the same mistakes twice.
Lauren
Thank you for your thoughts. I was tremendously POed at my father for walking down to my grandmothers house- even though, as I said, she literally lives 100 feet down the road. But what can I do? He doesn't keep animals, and he doesn't understand how even a few minutes on a porch can be horrible.
Again, there's a lot that I know now that I didn't know two days ago. Rest assured, that any future animal shipments will go to FedEx and be picked up at 9 AM. Regardless. I have the FedEx delivery email, and she was delivered at 2:14, and I was home at 2:15 according to my car clock. So she can't have sat on the porch that long, and I really think at that point it didn't matter, because she had been in the non-climate controlled FedEx truck since 9 or 10 that morning! That's at least 4 hours in high 90 degree heat! While she was in shed!
I guess it was just too much for her.
But thank you Kathy, for your advice. I read your book cover to cover, twice, in anticipation of my babies arrival. I've been so excited about her- I've told everyone and now I feel like a real moron.
Thanks to everyone else who has provided advice on the shipping so I don't make the same mistakes twice.
Lauren
Susan
Go Ahead, Make My Day!
First off, I take full responsibility for the loss of Lauren's new snake. I am fairly new to shipping snakes...have done only a few last year and this year and this is the first problem I have had. I used the largest ice pack I had, but apparently, it wasn't enough in this particular situation. I will know better next time. The few minutes that the package was left at the door was not a factor in this case, as the damage had already been done.
I am replacing Lauren's hatchling, at no charge, and this time, the package will be picked up at the hub and contain extra ice packs, if needed, depending upon the weather.
Dale and Joe...Thank you very much for all your support! You guys are terrific!
This is the sister to the lost hatchling and I hope Lauren will accept her as a replacement.
I am replacing Lauren's hatchling, at no charge, and this time, the package will be picked up at the hub and contain extra ice packs, if needed, depending upon the weather.
Dale and Joe...Thank you very much for all your support! You guys are terrific!
This is the sister to the lost hatchling and I hope Lauren will accept her as a replacement.
Last edited:
Emanon
This and That
I knew susan would be making things right!
On a side note... I think that as buyers it is our responsibility to talk with the breeder BEFORE we post a complaint about the snake UAD and saying that breeders name on the board. People will make snap judgements on that breeder before the breeder has even had a chance to make things right. I am with many who knew Susan would make this right and it is a bummer to have this aired out on the board. If the breeder and the seller have spoken and still cannot work things out then that is different and the gloves are off but in this instance I feel that susan should have been contacted before this post was even thought of.
Who knows... maybe she was and was not given ample time to respond... still think it should have waited until a solution was reached between seller and buyer. :shrugs:
On a side note... I think that as buyers it is our responsibility to talk with the breeder BEFORE we post a complaint about the snake UAD and saying that breeders name on the board. People will make snap judgements on that breeder before the breeder has even had a chance to make things right. I am with many who knew Susan would make this right and it is a bummer to have this aired out on the board. If the breeder and the seller have spoken and still cannot work things out then that is different and the gloves are off but in this instance I feel that susan should have been contacted before this post was even thought of.
Who knows... maybe she was and was not given ample time to respond... still think it should have waited until a solution was reached between seller and buyer. :shrugs:
Joejr14
Grand Bubble Burster
I agree, and while I understand the poster was emotional about the snake dying, you've got to be careful about what you post.
I jumped up and responded as soon as I saw this:
Just have to be careful what you post, because unfortunately they can have some pretty severe ramifications.
I jumped up and responded as soon as I saw this:
Just have to be careful what you post, because unfortunately they can have some pretty severe ramifications.
dionythicus
Kiss My Hearse
I had no doubts that everything would be worked out between Hypancistrus and Susan. The debate really turned off-topic for a little bit. It is terrible that a snake died, I'm so sorry, but it's great that it's being replaced. This is simply a risk that comes with running any business and using a third party (in this case Fed Ex) as a go between. I am using this as a lesson guide for when I start shipping very soon. I am paranoid about the heat.
desertanimal
2003 UB313
Emanon said:
Agreed on every point. I don't think Lauren meant anything at all by it, and just needed to talk it out, but I agree that buyers should take care about such things.
Hypancistrus
New member
I was very, VERY emotional when I posted that, and in NO WAY did I ever think that this wouldn't be fixed. To be honest, I was just terrified that I had killed her somehow! I've been really nervous about getting her, ever since I put in my order, and I thought that this was just proof that I am not meant to be a snake parent. So I apologize if the post came off as negative towards Susan's business, as it was not meant to be.
The thing about the heat pack... well, I figured that the heat pack was put in to keep her warm in an Air Conditioned truck, and that having the heat pack, plus the heat of Baltimore overwhelmed her. But it was a cold pack, and it was just THAT hot here Thursday that when I felt it, it truly felt like a heat pack.
I will go out of my way to say that I have had a wonderful experience talking to Susan about this snake purchase the past few months (we've been in contact since May of this year), and even given the death of this hatchling, I am still 100% satisfied, and would not only buy from her again, but also reccomend her to other members and friends. Her anery's, especially, are the most beautiful anery's I have seen, and that is from severaly months worth of looking at different breeders and pictures of anery's.
I had emailed Susan when I posted this and was awaiting a reply. So again, I sincerely apologize, Susan, if this post sounded like bad PR for you- it was not meant to be. I was just trying to deal with a loss that hit me very hard on many levels.
The thing about the heat pack... well, I figured that the heat pack was put in to keep her warm in an Air Conditioned truck, and that having the heat pack, plus the heat of Baltimore overwhelmed her. But it was a cold pack, and it was just THAT hot here Thursday that when I felt it, it truly felt like a heat pack.
I will go out of my way to say that I have had a wonderful experience talking to Susan about this snake purchase the past few months (we've been in contact since May of this year), and even given the death of this hatchling, I am still 100% satisfied, and would not only buy from her again, but also reccomend her to other members and friends. Her anery's, especially, are the most beautiful anery's I have seen, and that is from severaly months worth of looking at different breeders and pictures of anery's.
I had emailed Susan when I posted this and was awaiting a reply. So again, I sincerely apologize, Susan, if this post sounded like bad PR for you- it was not meant to be. I was just trying to deal with a loss that hit me very hard on many levels.
kathylove
Pragmatic & Logical
Hi Susan!
I think everyone here expected it would be worked out since you have such a good reputation. I kind of thought it likely that you hadn't run into this problem before, or you would have taken steps to avoid it.
Although it is good for buyer and seller to try to work things out privately, it is not entirely bad that an honest mistake is discussed here, along with its satisfactory resolution and possible solutions to avoid it in the future. Not only the two people involved have learned from this unfortunate mistake, but others who haven't shipped yet may be able to avoid the same mistake. So the little snake didn't die completely in vain! Although it seems a shame that it is the animals that pay for our mistakes, we still have to keep it in perspective by realizing that Mother Nature raises a far smaller percentage to adulthood than we do.
I think prospective customers can appreciate when we do the best we can, try to learn from our mistakes, and make it right with the customer. What else can we do?
I think everyone here expected it would be worked out since you have such a good reputation. I kind of thought it likely that you hadn't run into this problem before, or you would have taken steps to avoid it.
Although it is good for buyer and seller to try to work things out privately, it is not entirely bad that an honest mistake is discussed here, along with its satisfactory resolution and possible solutions to avoid it in the future. Not only the two people involved have learned from this unfortunate mistake, but others who haven't shipped yet may be able to avoid the same mistake. So the little snake didn't die completely in vain! Although it seems a shame that it is the animals that pay for our mistakes, we still have to keep it in perspective by realizing that Mother Nature raises a far smaller percentage to adulthood than we do.
I think prospective customers can appreciate when we do the best we can, try to learn from our mistakes, and make it right with the customer. What else can we do?
Susan
Go Ahead, Make My Day!
Thanks Kathy!
I sincerely hope that more than just Lauren and I have learned something from this situation. I am a firm believer that nothing happens without a reason and that most of the time, there is a lesson that needs to be learned.
I am just sorry that I wasn't able to get back to Lauren any sooner than I did to assuage her fears. I'm unable to check e-mail at work and then, with the afternoon/evening thunderstorms that we've been experiencing lately, I can't go on-line until they pass. Once I was aware of the problem, Lauren and I had it resolved almost immediately.
I sincerely hope that more than just Lauren and I have learned something from this situation. I am a firm believer that nothing happens without a reason and that most of the time, there is a lesson that needs to be learned.
I am just sorry that I wasn't able to get back to Lauren any sooner than I did to assuage her fears. I'm unable to check e-mail at work and then, with the afternoon/evening thunderstorms that we've been experiencing lately, I can't go on-line until they pass. Once I was aware of the problem, Lauren and I had it resolved almost immediately.