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PayPal Disputes Involving Animals

crackerhead

crackerhead

Hug Free Zone
I'm curious to hear about anybody's experiences with Paypal Disputes involving animal/corn snake purchases. Is there a written/stated policy with regard to the disposition of such transactions? Do they fall under the auspice of goods or are they in a separate category?
Once I have heard from a few members I'll share my most recent and only foray into PayPal's dispute quagmire. It is amusing and possibly distressing at the same time!

Thanks in advance,
Terri
 
I think animals would be considered goods. I had a dispute a couple of years ago. I paid for snakes that were never shipped. After exhausting all avenues with the seller I filed a dispute with Pay Pal. They froze his account until the dispute was settled. The guy immediately shipped the snakes and I told Pay Pal I was satisfied. It was quick and easy.
 
Never had a paypal dispute with animals....but I've seen it in eBay a couple times.

One time I bought a "complete" magazine collection that turned out missing 12 issues....Paypal sided with the seller. Not sure how...but they did. :(
 
Here's the situation. As some of you may have already read I ordered 2.3 Champagnes from a guy but I received 3.2. How one mis-sexes transparent snakes is beyond me but I digress. I tried to resolve the issue with the seller to no avail. After two weeks I instituted a PayPal Dispute for the incorrectly sexed animal. I entered it under "significantly not what I ordered" or some such wording. My assumption was that males of a species were significantly not like the females unless we are talking earthworms. PayPal decided in favor of the seller.
I thought this was a VERY necessary topic to bring to the community's attention should this be a common occurence within PayPal. If we can not be assured their protection because we are dealing in live animals I believe that fact changes a lot of how we do business. I have been under the ?false? notion that my animal purchases were covered by the Goods section of PayPal. Apparently they are not. This is troubling. Thoughts?

Terri
 
Apologies, there are two possible issues here and I wonder if you could clarify Paypal's feedback to you?

I have been under the ?false? notion that my animal purchases were covered by the Goods section of PayPal. Apparently they are not.
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- Paypal don't cover animal purchases at all and your dispute was turned down.

or

I instituted a PayPal Dispute for the incorrectly sexed animal. I entered it under "significantly not what I ordered" or some such wording. My assumption was that males of a species were significantly not like the females unless we are talking earthworms. PayPal decided in favor of the seller.
Click to expand...
- Paypal do cover animal purchases, but in this instance they decided that there was no significant difference between a male and a female (possible from a non-breeder, layman's point of view, no matter how chuffing infuriating), hence they decided in the seller's favour.
 
It seems as long as you get a snake, Paypal doesn't understand the issue of what sex it is being a problem. Did you get to see what the seller wrote? Maybe they said they sold it in good faith, but must have made an error or maybe they even said that you were in error over the sex. Someone who has no clue about snakes (ie. the person at Paypal sitting there deciding your fate) wouldn't understand how easy it should be for the seller to have sexed the animals properly. They would see this as a case of he said/she said and since 5 snakes were received, they decided in favour of the seller.

Not a good thing, but I'm not sure how to fix it. :(
 
I've heard conflicting reports on PayPal disputes, though I've never filed one. Some people say they never back up the buyer but then I've also heard of a number of times that they did. It's talked about quite a bit on Fauna, I think in the General business section. I've read a few posts about this issue on several other forums as well. I think the general consensus is to use a credit card when paying for animals & if PayPal won't work with you, the credit companies are supposed to be way more easy to deal with in a dispute.
 
Tavia said:
. I think the general consensus is to use a credit card when paying for animals & if PayPal won't work with you, the credit companies are supposed to be way more easy to deal with in a dispute.
Click to expand...

I agree with this. Use a CC tied to your PayPal account so if PayPal does not side with you do a charge back on your card. This works best if you use a card with a good service record. What were you trying to do get a refund and send all the snakes back or just get a female exchanges for a male.

Also look at terms of service of the seller I have started seeing several that do not guarantee the sex of the animals sold. If this is the case you may not have any recourse.
 
All I wanted was to be refunded for was the price of the offending male snake, $60. Personally if I was the seller of an incorrectly sexed animal I would have A. apologized profusely, B. Sent the correct sex snake at my cost should one be available, C. Refund the purchase price plus time and trouble should I not have the right sex available, D. Offer to allow the offended party to keep the incorrectly sexed animal or send a shipping label to have the animal returned to me should they not want it. So I thought refunding the purchase price for only the one snake was pretty darn fair. I guess I live in a parallel universe or something?
Bitsy I too am confused as to what I was actually denied hence the thread. I'm hoping it was a snafu on the part of understanding the situation as opposed to just not covering animals in general. If it is the latter we all need to rethink how we do business. I'll need to come to terms with the loss. Which would be easier if the seller were not such a <insert the most horrible curse you can think of here>!
Terri
 
Were the 2 sexes priced differently? Does the seller have any mention in their terms agreement concerning errors in sex? Incorrectly sexed snakes happen. Consider yourself lucky that you found out now instead of 3 years from now and it's breeding season. You paid for a snake, you got a snake. Yeah, it stinks the sex is wrong, but they did offer you some compensation at least, which is better than nothing.
 
airenlow said:
It was in the "insiders" thread. I believe they offered a refund of half the price of the extra male.
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Was that with the understanding that the OP would keep the male? Or, was that a, "we will give you half refund, but you send us the snake back" ?
 
The seller offered to give me half my money back and I could keep the male and sell it to recoup my loss. I find that to be an unfair burden given that he is making me "pay" for his mistake. The animal is of no use to me and it is a continuing loss given it's need for care.
Males and females were priced the same and there was no mention in the sellers agreement about errors of any kind. And yeah, I'm glad I found out before three year's passed but the statement "You paid for a snake, you got a snake" is a kin to saying it would have been justifiable for him to have sent me an Anaconda or a long dead animal. If PayPal views it this way, I restate my thought that none of us should be paying for animals this way should we be using it as a means of payment protection.

Terri
 
I understand your frustration, but I wouldn't be too angry with the seller. Having them pay for shipping him back and pay shipping the other way would seem a bit much to ask on a $60 snake. I think I'd have refunded the whole price rather than half if it was my mistake, but I don't think it compares to being sent a dead snake or anaconda...
 
I agree with you Terri, you were mistreated by both the seller and Pay Pal. I don't know of anyway to correct the problem however. I do think you should make the name of the seller known so others can avoid him.
 
crackerhead said:
If PayPal views it this way, I restate my thought that none of us should be paying for animals this way should we be using it as a means of payment protection.
Click to expand...


So then how should we? As in all things, it's a case of buyer beware and the first step is checking what the guarantee is and asking questions if you're not sure. If you don't agree with the terms, don't buy from that person. It would also be a good idea to check some references or ask around. If not, realize you're taking a risk and if you're agreeable to that, go ahead and buy from the person. Paypal is not an expert in snakes, so it's a case of he said/she said and they can only do their best. As far as not using Paypal, what other options are available? It sucks this happened. Most of us have been there in some way or another and can sympathize, but consider it lesson learned. At least you got something.
 
At this point I'm not seeking correction of the mis-sexed snake issue. It really isn't worth the effort involved.
I just wanted to bring to the attention of the forum members that the use of PayPal as a secure way of paying for animals may not be as secure as first assumed. I did check out the seller before hand and I usually only buy from people I know very well but that is not my point.
As for what other choices do we have, I might suggest like a previous poster that credit cards or Postal Money Orders be a better choice at this juncture. To laud PayPal as the only way isn't acceptable to me. I opened an account pretty much for the sole purpose of purchasing/selling animals. I rarely use their services otherwise and I've never had need of their dispute services till this incident. Given my lack of experience with disputed purchases, I'm just wondering if I should rethink my approach.

Terri
 
Does anyone have any experience with a credit card company in a similar incident? I'm just wondering if they would be any better or if their stance would be the same as Paypal, again, due to lack of knowledge? Would they see it the same; you paid for a snake, you got a snake? In any case, why not use your credit card through Paypal and get double protection? This way, the seller doesn't get your credit card information.

How would a postal money order protect you? I thought that once cashed, that's it.

For what it's worth, I have had 2 experiences with the Paypal dispute service. In the first case, I ordered a necklace with the astrological symbol for Cancer, but received a necklace of some other sign. I emailed the seller, but got no response, so I opened a dispute. I didn't get anything out of that. I guess they figured, I got a necklace. In the second case, I didn't receive a product at all and got my money back on that one.
 
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