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Charcoal Motley? Or Anery?

Regit

Regit

New member
Hey guys. I picked up this girl off kijiji a few weeks ago. She was sold to me as a "charcoal motley" and came with a male "Bloodred stripe" I'm 95% sure the blood stripe is just a normal stripe, but he'll probably be test-bred either way.

I know charcoal motleys are very rare, so I'm hesitant to call her that, but she doesn't look like any anery motleys I've seen... No yellow, very dark, absolutely gorgeous. I love dark snakes!!

Opinions? Thoughts? She's going to be tested with an anery either this year or next, just looking for some feedback now.

Pictures are of her freshly shed (she just dropped a clutch of slugs -.- Kinda disappointing, because she was co-habbed with the "blood stripe" before coming to me. Unfortunately it's not warm enough for outdoor pics yet, so they're indoor with flash, but fairly accurate colouration.

Thanks!!
 

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I would call her an anery motley. She's a fully mature snake and I don't think charcoal motleys have been around long enough to get one that old...and that would be in an "average Joe's" co-habbed collection as he would have had to pay a pretty penny for her.
 
She is really pretty, I like her dark color as well. If you decide to breed her in the future she could give some nice hatchlings with the right mate. Sorry about the slugs, but be happy she passed them all out with out any problems. If she stays in great shape you can try breeding her again next year with the male of your choice (if she decides to accept him :)).
 
Looks like a solid anery to me. Love how the saddles look reversed at the front and switch down the snakes body.
 
Susan said:
I would call her an anery motley. She's a fully mature snake and I don't think charcoal motleys have been around long enough to get one that old...and that would be in an "average Joe's" co-habbed collection as he would have had to pay a pretty penny for her.
Click to expand...

It is always possible for "average Joe" to end up with a valuable snake - unlikely, but possible. I did a breeding loan with a "ghost" that turned out to actually be an ultra anery. This snake was bought before ultra was even really known about from a local show for $25 as a hatchling. So it is possible for random stuff to end up in collections.

But I agree with everyone else - anery motley.
 
I would also agree with the post'ers before me...Anery Motley. But what perks my interest in this snake is the apparent lack of yellow...or is it just my monitor..the pics..or what?? and as metioned before...Shes Dark!..I'm liking that....i mean I'm liking that alot...a Dark Anery..with minimal yellow??? :)
 
Anery Motley that looks possibly due to shed. For me, it's in the eye. Gray iris, not black.

D80
 
I agree, she's a very pretty Anery Motley. I too, think she might be in shed, possibly in the clear phase...?

The eye was my first clue as well.
I have read that Anery A's can have reduced or no yellow & that Anery B's/Charcoal can have yellow, so that isn't necessarily a good indicator anymore.
IMHO, she could have some hets that affect the amount of yellow she has...just a thought.
Good luck with future breeding plans!
 
nwheather said:
I agree, she's a very pretty Anery Motley. I too, think she might be in shed, possibly in the clear phase...?

The eye was my first clue as well.
I have read that Anery A's can have reduced or no yellow & that Anery B's/Charcoal can have yellow, so that isn't necessarily a good indicator anymore.
IMHO, she could have some hets that affect the amount of yellow she has...just a thought.
Good luck with future breeding plans!
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Not to trash this thread....but nwheather...you bring up a valid point. would being het for motley have an effect on the yellowing?? your thoughts? Just curious.....
 
rich333 said:
Not to trash this thread....but nwheather...you bring up a valid point. would being het for motley have an effect on the yellowing?? your thoughts? Just curious.....
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I could be way off, but that was just a guess. I have seen how sometimes hets can alter the look a bit, so I threw that out there :)
 
My understanding was that the Anerythristic morph often developed yellow on the chin and throat, whereas that yellowing was usually lacking in Charcoals?
 
nwheather said:
I could be way off, but that was just a guess. I have seen how sometimes hets can alter the look a bit, so I threw that out there :)
Click to expand...

ok, fair enough...the reason i asked (Again, Sorry..not trying to trash the OP's post) My ultramel Charcoal (which i'm sure by now,everyone has seen) Has no yellow at all on her...and she is PH motley...Just wondering if that..somehow could be a marker of sorts.
 
Marica said:
My understanding was that the Anerythristic morph often developed yellow on the chin and throat, whereas that yellowing was usually lacking in Charcoals?
Click to expand...

Nah,

Not for a long time...The original "pine Island Anery" later coined "Charcoal" was completely lacking yellow...when bred to An Anery A the resulting clutch produced babies that had yellow...And pretty much every since....Charcoals and Anerys have yellowing on the chin and neck areas. Anyone else with more info on this subject?? Feel free to correct me if i'm wrong.
 
Blue Apple Herps said:
It is always possible for "average Joe" to end up with a valuable snake - unlikely, but possible. I did a breeding loan with a "ghost" that turned out to actually be an ultra anery. This snake was bought before ultra was even really known about from a local show for $25 as a hatchling. So it is possible for random stuff to end up in collections.

But I agree with everyone else - anery motley.
Click to expand...

I'm sure that just about any morph/combo could end up being the average corn snake in the average home. Breeders wholesale by-product normals all the time, and just the right pair could end up as the first-timer's breeding pair, having just the right hets match up (I found dilute hidden in my collection), but for it to be labeled and sold as such an uncommon morph combo, and as a mature breedable female...that's where I think the odds go off the scale. It could still happen...and I could win the lottery as well. ;)

Now my opinion about yellow on charcoals and anerys...I've seen both with and without all sorts of varying amounts of yellow. However, I have noticed a slight variation in the shade of yellow seen more often in each morph. Charcoals tend to have the same shade wherever it is seen, and it tends to be a lighter, more cooler yellow, whereas anerys can have varying shades of yellow on the same specimen (nose is different than on chin, which is different than on neck, etc) and the shades tend to be a warmer yellow.
 
Maybe my monitor but the snake looks like it does have some yellow on the face and neck. Not bright in your face yellow. But light yellow on the face and a tint of it on the neck.
 
WingedSweetheart said:
Maybe my monitor but the snake looks like it does have some yellow on the face and neck. Not bright in your face yellow. But light yellow on the face and a tint of it on the neck.
Click to expand...

I see it too.

Susan said:
Now my opinion about yellow on charcoals and anerys...I've seen both with and without all sorts of varying amounts of yellow. However, I have noticed a slight variation in the shade of yellow seen more often in each morph. Charcoals tend to have the same shade wherever it is seen, and it tends to be a lighter, more cooler yellow, whereas anerys can have varying shades of yellow on the same specimen (nose is different than on chin, which is different than on neck, etc) and the shades tend to be a warmer yellow.
Click to expand...

I've noticed the same thing. The aneries (and my snow stripe) in my collection have a very brilliant 'daffodil' type yellow, and the charcoals that are showing yellow have a much more pale shade.

I'd guess that it is an anery motley.
 
ok,
So...no expert here by a long shot....Anery's can have no yellow..or some yellow or alot of yellow....anery B can have same as above..just depends on individual animal, and the color intensity is more apparent in anery's ? Ok..I'll buy that. Now, whats different in the anery's and charcoals that don't show the yellow..as opposed to the ones that do? Is it a genetic switch within the individual animal? Sorta like humans...I'm sure if i worked out every day.ate healthy, and lifted heavy weights...i might be in better shape....but i don't believe i'd end up looking like arnold or lou ferigno. I'm just not genetically geared for such muscle mass. Perhaps if a person could isolate this "switch" one could either breed for anery's & charcoals with no yellow..or the other way...with Massive amounts of yellow...More than what is already seen. I'm sure someone is already working on that..just needed to unload my brain so i can go to sleep......nite all.
 
I go with susan on the yellow factor, having seems both anery A and B both with and without yellow.
also, I'm not 100% convinced its actually a pure corn snake. The head doesnt quite look right for some reason.
If someone has sold you an incorrect morph, then its possible the sex is wrong, as could be the age, and could be the species..
I hope I am wrong of course..

Having had charcoal motleys from Jeff, I am 100% certain this isnt one.
 
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