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Research 4 Story

Pal-O-Mine

Pal-O-Mine

New member
Some of you may or may not know that I am currently writing a work of fiction ( in the vampire genre. Publishing date? Who knows! :shrugs: Sometime before 2012! )

Anyhow, currently I'm in the part of the story where 2 characters are discussing the proper way to dispatch a vampire and the authority on the topic mentions snake venom. Well I kinda need help here. I need to know what kinds of snakes have venom that affects the blood and which is the most deadly.

So I thought I'd give you guys a stab at it first!

Of course proper credit will be given to the person and the site. You just may have to wait several YEARS before seeing your name in lights as the person I went to for such info!;)

Devon
 
http://tinyurl.com/62xeom

1) Fierce Snake or Inland Taipan (Oxyuranus microlepidotus ), Australia. The most toxic venom of any snake. Maximum yield recorded (for one bite) is 110mg. That would porbably be enough to kill over 100 people or 250,000 mice. With an LD50 of 0.01 mg/kg, it is about 10 times as venomous as a Mojave rattlesnake and 750 times as venomous as a common cobra.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taipan

One species, the inland taipan (also known as the fierce snake and small-scaled snake), has the most toxic venom of any snake species worldwide[2], although it is not the most deadly. The venom clots the victims blood, blocking arteries or veins, and using up clotting factors. The taipan was named by Donald Thompson after the word used by the Wik-Mungkan Aboriginal people of central Cape York Peninsula, Queensland, Australia.[3]
 
You need to speak with Dr Bryan fry at Venom doc... He's a world authority on venom...
I'm off to work ATM, but as soon as I get back I'll send you some sites and people who know their stuff.... You can guarantee there input....
 
Nanci said:
http://tinyurl.com/62xeom

1) Fierce Snake or Inland Taipan (Oxyuranus microlepidotus ), Australia. The most toxic venom of any snake. Maximum yield recorded (for one bite) is 110mg. That would porbably be enough to kill over 100 people or 250,000 mice. With an LD50 of 0.01 mg/kg, it is about 10 times as venomous as a Mojave rattlesnake and 750 times as venomous as a common cobra.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taipan

One species, the inland taipan (also known as the fierce snake and small-scaled snake), has the most toxic venom of any snake species worldwide[2], although it is not the most deadly. The venom clots the victims blood, blocking arteries or veins, and using up clotting factors. The taipan was named by Donald Thompson after the word used by the Wik-Mungkan Aboriginal people of central Cape York Peninsula, Queensland, Australia.[3]
Click to expand...
Elapids carry mainly neurotoxins, haemotoxins are a viper thing....
You don't want the most venomous, but the strongest digestive toxin, yes????
 
But if they didn't, (I don't know if they do, or not) and the vampire killers didn't know that, and they went to all the trouble to get the venomous snake and plant it- surprise!
 
In my mind a neurotoxin would be like Aspirin or a shot of Whiskey to a Vampire but a haemotoxin could really mess them up. I'd suggest looking for the highest concentration of haemotoxin, probably a sea snake.
 
I LOVE all the questions you're asking! It makes me think which takes the story in different directions which ultimately makes it better.

Everyone who writes a vampire story has to figure out what the rules are for vampires IN THEIR WORLD. Something I came to discover very quickly. ( Do they sleep in coffins or beds?? Do they walk around in daylight or not? etc. Do crosses work and more importantly, why? )

My vampires are based on most classic vampires. No daywalking! But they CAN regenerate from most things that would kill a human. Blood related things can affect them to varying degrees depending on their age. They need to drink blood to replentish what they don't have. ( I guess their spleen which makes and stores blood no longer works! )

Anyway, back to the snake question. Let's see. Something that easily gets grumpy. ( Its the drama thing you know! ) I was going to say no Australian breeds because the story doesn't visit that continent. BUT whose to say some snake wrangler doesn't bring a Taipan to them????

Thanks for the Venom reference! I will have to check that out.

Devon
 
Vampires drink blood because blood carries prana and vampires don't produce their own prana???
 
Yes. That's why in my story, it won't work for a vampire to keep the blood chilled or take infusions of it. The prana has left by that time.

Eli made some good points too. Thanks!

Don't you just hate reading a story where its obvious the author didn't do their homework?? I like fantasy and most of the time, when fantasy authors bring a horse into the story, I can tell they only seen pics of one! There is a fantasy novel called "Green Rider" where the author was a forest ranger and an equestrian. It SOOOO SHOWED the way she wound her story!


Devon
 
"There is a fantasy novel called "Green Rider" where the author was a forest ranger and an equestrian..."

Does that mean you have been hanging out with vampires, lol?

I love vampire stories - books AND movies! I can help you proof it when you are getting close, if you like.

Hubby has been writing a novel on and off for several years now. It is an adventure story (no vampires, though!) - kind of a cross between Indiana Jones, Crocodile Dundee, and his own brand of "Memories and Fantasies of a Young Herper" - it is a fun read so far!

Good luck on your book - you will probably finish before hubby does!
 
Actually the first book is finished and I am now doing the query letter and synopsis hoochie-koo with the agents. ( 2 rejects so far! :( sniff! ) I had to write a second novel because my small circle of fans so far were threatening to lynch me with how it ended! Some actually wanted to know more back story on the villain! I figured that there was 300 years of little stories here and there that I had never touched on in book one so okay here goes.

That's where the snake question came in. We're going into more detail here and I'm having to flesh out more things. Great! Now I have to do a WHOLE LOT MORE RESEARCH! Like on WWII and Asian superstitions and German politics before WWII etc. etc. and so on.

This is why I like fantasy! I GET TO MAKE UP THE HISTORY! ARRRRGGGHHH!!!!

Can we swap stories? Maybe me pestering him on what comes next will fire him to finish it.

Devon
 
I'm back.... I've emailed a mate of mine to see if he will have a chat with you about venom.... He's an authority on the subject as well as having an extensive medical background. What he doesn't know about venom, isn't worth knowing...LOL Hopfully he's not to busy and will oblige you....
To get you started you should look here
Dr Bryan Grieg Fry
This guy knows his stuff and the forum members ain't no slouches either....
As for Vipers that can fit the bill for you.....
You have some mean venom on your door step, so to speak with Crotalus...
Then there's Bitis if you are importing snakes into your story, with Bitis gabonica,
yielding massive amounts of venom.....
If you go to S.America there's the largest viper of all Lachesis muta muta...
Though if it was my story I would some how try to use
Zhaoermia mangshanensis

This is a very rare viper from China... A truly beautiful animal.....

Just to give you something else to think about....
Cytotoxins...
These are in some venoms as well.... The Brown recluse is known for it as well as puff adders...
Treating cells with a cytotoxic compound can result in a variety of cell fates. The cells may undergo necrosis, in which they lose membrane integrity and die rapidly as a result of cell lysis. The cells can stop actively growing and dividing (a decrease in cell viability), or the cells can activate a genetic program of controlled cell death (apoptosis).
Cells undergoing necrosis typically exhibit rapid swelling, lose membrane integrity, shut down metabolism and release their contents into the environment. Cells that undergo rapid necrosis in vitro do not have sufficient time or energy to activate apoptotic machinery and will not express apoptotic markers. Apoptosis is characterized by well defined cytological and molecular events including a change in the refractive index of the cell, cytoplasmic shrinkage, nuclear condensation and cleavage of DNA into regularly sized fragments. Cells in culture that are undergoing apoptosis eventually undergo secondary necrosis. They will shut down metabolism, lose membrane integrity and lyse.
 
Oh goody! More snake stuff to do research on and get situation ideas from!

I DID check out Dr. Fry's site last night. ( Somehow I was expecting him to be an older, grey haired, distinguished gentlemen; not some young, buff, adrenaline junkie, bald dude!) Anyway, fascinating site! The guy really knows his stuff when it comes to poisonous snakes. However, I felt I needed a translator to "dumb down" the talk when it came to the nature of hemotoxin. ( I'm so disappointed in myself that I couldn't get his techno-babble! )

I will check out the other sites you recommended. Thanks!

Devon
 
This site is excellent
venomland.forumotions.com/venom
You'll find most of them on there use their real names... (always a good sign)
You should be able to ask your question there, and get straight answers, at a level that suits you...
Look out for
Wolfgang Wüster
He's probably the worlds expert on venom....

 
Last edited:
Mike,

Thanks for the info!

Okay I'm auditioning vipers with hemotoxin for a BIT part in my story. ( Yes, pun was intended! ) Let's see Lachesis muta muta does not do well in captivity so no go for the story there. I've seen Bitis gabonica on nature shows and while I LOVE the way Mother Nature painted this snake with geometric designs that can only be properly appreciated from every angle, its temperment seems too placid. ( It might just sit there while the vampire steps over it! ) I need something REALLY GRUMPY like, "Hey you're sharing my oxygen and I don't like it even though you're 20 feet away! I'm still gonna get ya!"

Now on the Zhaoermia mangshanensis, OH.......MY.......GOD! What a looker! I have a personal list of snakes I will never own because while they're pretty, they're also DEADLY! Well, the Mangshan pit viper just won second place on that list! ( Malaysian coral snake got first. Maybe I'll make a calendar. )

Anyway, its drop dead beautiful! Literally! It can be well camoflaged. It can stand colder temps. ( Always a good thing! ) It SPITS its venom! Great talent! The whole world knows about spitting cobras. This is a great opportunity to teach the general public something truthful in a fictitious tale and it adds so much drama to the story line. AND most importantly, a big chunk of my story happens in China! So this snake is a great fit to the story's puzzle so far. How grumpy are they???

I still need to talk to that authority friend of yours on the affects of this snake's venom on the human body. How fast does it react? What are the first signs? How many people could the venom kill in one bite? Etc. etc.

I'm still amazed with the directions this story is taking me in. In the last book, I had to talk to a friend of mine who used to be a forensic pathologist.

Now all I need is to talk to someone who knows a lot about Asian vampires, superstition and magic.

OH! And get published!

Devon
 
I really don't know much about Zhaoermia mangshanensis, but I believe they are nocturnal.....
Luckily, I know a man that once kept them.... I'll email him and see if he gets back in touch....
 
Pal-O-Mine said:
Everyone who writes a vampire story has to figure out what the rules are for vampires IN THEIR WORLD. Something I came to discover very quickly. ( Do they sleep in coffins or beds?? Do they walk around in daylight or not? etc. Do crosses work and more importantly, why? )
Click to expand...

That's one of the reasons I LOVE vampire novels! You get something different and unique each time. Anne Rice's Vampires are the ones I know best, I like they way she deals with them, getting stronger as they get older, NOT spontaneously bursting into flames the minute sunlight hits them, able to heal after even the most fatal harm is bestowed upon them.
Immortal means immortal...

But then again, the scariest, creepiest, vampire novel I've read is hands down Salem's Lot. Stephen King's vampire world takes on more of a zombie feel to it though.

You COULD try to trick a vampire into sucking the blood of someone or something that had been bitten by a venomous snake, but that might be hard to pull off.

You'll have to come back here and let us know when you've published! In the mean time, what are your favorite vampire stories? I'm always looking for new material.

Have you seen Let the Right one In yet? I like the way they stay true to the traditions of inviting a vampire in. I swear, after reading Salem's Lot that's the ONLY thing that helped me sleep.

Oh, for some reason I've always envisioned a vampire getting stuck outside near dawn and frantically digging a hole/burrow into the ground with its bear fingernails. I think they could do that if necessary.

Okay, enough from me, seeing as how I rambled on about everything besides what you wanted to know. ;)
 
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