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RIP Clementine, my beautiful boa lassie. (Updated PM results)

Oh, Elle... I don't know what to say. My eyes are full of tears just thinking about you and what you and your little ones are going through. I'm a world away and have nothing that I can offer but my heart and my thoughts, wishes and dreams.

I do hope and pray that none of the other snakes has ANYTHING and can live long and healthy lives in your loving care. Know that you continue to be in my heart...
 
I am sure admitting to having a snake die from IBD is practically committing public suicide, but it's bastards that DON'T admit these things and take the necessary precautions to deal with the situation responsibly that how people like myself get into these situations.

And it also highlights the utter importance of quarantine and how dangerous mites really are. Never take mites lightly if you have boas and pythons. It's a fatal lesson I have learnt...
 
I'm so very sorry, Elle. I do respect your integrity as a keeper, but I'm so sorry that your collection may be doomed by the irresponsibility of another. Life is so damn unfair sometimes.

Thoughts and prayers to you, sweet Elle.
 
Well that really sucks. What are the chances anyone else in your collection has it? Do you think she had it when you bought her? I'm very sorry, Elle.
 
Does this include the snakes kept at your ex's, the sunbeams, everything? Will your corns will be safe?
 
Nanci said:
Well that really sucks. What are the chances anyone else in your collection has it? Do you think she had it when you bought her? I'm very sorry, Elle.
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Yes there is a HUGE chance. I am sure most of my snakes had mites. And that's the most common way for IBD to be passed from one snake to another. I don't know if she had it when I bought her as a baby. But I will be contacting her breeder to let him know and ask if he has had any snake deaths. I am sure I won't get an answer. What reputable breeder is going to be man enough to say yeah I have had snakes die off? But I didn't get any PM's done so I don't know what of....

I don't care when it came from. I will however be making every single person I have ever dealt with aware of the situation. I won't be hiding anything. It's not about which snake came into my collection with it, it's about protecting other people so this can never happen to anyone else. I would never wish it on my worst enemy. The heartache is unbearable...

diamondlil said:
Does this include the snakes kept at your ex's, the sunbeams, everything? Will your corns will be safe?
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I don't know J9. Who knows where it came from. All I know is I never had any problems with the health of my snakes until I brought in that group of carinata which were the source of the mites. So I am having at least one of them euthanised and tested.

Boas tend to last longer than pythons with the illness and it can harbour for years however as soon as they start showing symptoms there is no going back and essentially that snake is already dead.

Colubrids can carry the disease but don't show symptoms so don't die from it. It's boid aids essentially...

Thus why I could never ever pass on any of the colubrids despite the fact they will never show sings or symptoms. All it takes is for one of my snakes that may carry the disease to go into someone elses collection, contract mites and have the mites bite another persons snakes thus infecting all them.

Thus why I will never be able to breed either. I am actually unsure whether an infected mother can pass onto babies or eggs, however who in their right mind would buy from someone that openly admits to having a snake die of IBD.... I know I wouldnt.
 
Oh, Elle ... I am so sorry to see that the results were positive for IBD.
Was really hoping otherwise.
There is so much I want to say and, yet, I don't know what to say.
 
I was just 'off-site' reading a bit about it. The colubrids as carriers just adds a great twist to this doesn't it? Again, my heart goes out for your plans and for the loss of Clementine. I hope the others get to have long lives as your pets and still bring joy and beauty to you and all you share them with.
 
Elle, I'm assuming you mean that you can't buy or sell snakes again because you will still have animals that are potential carriers?
This is NOT a suggestion, but I'm just curious. With this disease, if you got rid of all your snakes and really really cleaned everything- Would you still be at risk of having any new animals contract the disease?

I'm so sorry to hear about it Elle. I know this is just heartbreaking for you..
 
That is so terrible, you have very high character to be so open about what happened, and I hope for the best possible results of your other snakes. This is very very sad to hear, and I sincerely wish you the very best, and hope there is light for you at the end of this dark tunnel.
 
My condolences Elle. What a horrible thing to have happen to you. I know how much joy you get from your collection and it's just terrible that it had to happen when it really didn't need to.
 
Elle I am really so sorry and I am very sad that this is happening. Of all the people on here your collection had to be my absolute favorite and I know how much you loved them and to think about this happening to anyone is just heartbreaking.

Is there anyway to test your snakes without euthanizing them?
 
diamondlil said:
I was just 'off-site' reading a bit about it. The colubrids as carriers just adds a great twist to this doesn't it? Again, my heart goes out for your plans and for the loss of Clementine. I hope the others get to have long lives as your pets and still bring joy and beauty to you and all you share them with.
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My plans mean nothing anymore. I was never particularly bothered about breeding snakes. I never bought any of my pets specifically FOR breeding. So that aspect is unfortunate but I can live with it. I have 2 gravid female boas at the moment but they are carinata. Never more than 4 babies at a time and they rarely survive in captivity. If they so I have room for potentially 8 more of the worlds smallest boa.

I just want to enjoy what time I have left with my other snakes. Whether it's one day or 20 years. I will just take it as it comes...

tom e said:
Elle, I'm assuming you mean that you can't buy or sell snakes again because you will still have animals that are potential carriers?
This is NOT a suggestion, but I'm just curious. With this disease, if you got rid of all your snakes and really really cleaned everything- Would you still be at risk of having any new animals contract the disease?

I'm so sorry to hear about it Elle. I know this is just heartbreaking for you..
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Yes Tom... It would be HIGHLY irresponsible of me to sell any of my snakes whether their blood tests come back negative for inclusions or not. Plus you learn to really appreciate what you have when you realise how special they are.

With IBD once you have destroyed every single animal (as they are ALL potential carriers) you are advised not to keep anything for 6 - 12 months then you can start building up your collection again. But this is not what I want to do. I fear if I lost all my snakes or had to destroy them all I would never be able to keep snakes again. The heartache would be just too much to bear.

Michael823 said:
That is so terrible, you have very high character to be so open about what happened, and I hope for the best possible results of your other snakes. This is very very sad to hear, and I sincerely wish you the very best, and hope there is light for you at the end of this dark tunnel.
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I am not going to do what someone did to me and hide the fact I have had a snake die from IBD and all my others are potential carriers. The best light I can hope for is having all my other snakes into old age and them dying naturally and beloved and well cared for pets...

MegF. said:
My condolences Elle. What a horrible thing to have happen to you. I know how much joy you get from your collection and it's just terrible that it had to happen when it really didn't need to.
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When does anything bad ever NEED to happen? I believe everything happens for a reason though, and if nothing else this is a bloody good test of character. I keep feeling like I'm going to fall apart and sometimes I don't know what to do. But then there are times when I am on auto pilot and know exactly what I need to do. It's very confusing and conflicting and yes you are right, I can't help but feel why did this happen.... why....??

Iguanagirl8662 said:
Elle I am really so sorry and I am very sad that this is happening. Of all the people on here your collection had to be my absolute favorite and I know how much you loved them and to think about this happening to anyone is just heartbreaking.

Is there anyway to test your snakes without euthanizing them?
Click to expand...

I will be taking in all of my boas and pythons for blood testing. You CAN test positive for inclusions in the blood (like Clementine did) however inclusions in the blood don't ALWAYS mean IBD. So I am taking in at least one snake to be euthanised and fully post mortem ed. It's a sacrifice I need to make...
 
I didn't mean need to in that way, I meant if the other person had been responsible it could have been prevented. It didn't need to happen. Sort of like being thrown thru a windshield in a car accident and killed when you could have been wearing a seatbelt and not had any injuries...that kind of need.
 
Elle, I am so sorry to hear that it was the worst news. I do hope that the rest of your animals test negative and they all live long and healthy lives...((hugs)).
 
Oh Elle... I am SO sorry... I know exactly what you're going through, having gone through it myself just over a year ago. ((((((((((Elle)))))))))))

I've never heard of the colubrids as a carrier, though.

I hope the breeder takes care of you, or at least responds.
 
Colubrids carry the disease but don't express it. Which makes them such a tricky and risky addition to the equation. Especially when mites come along and can pass infected blood from a colubrid to a boid.

The person I bought the carinata from (the source of the mites I am sure) has offered to help me quite a bit with vet bills and has been incredibly cooperative in responding and just generally been very nice. Whether his snakes are the ones that came in with IBD or not is beside the point. Whats done is done. I have this deadly disease in my collection... And it's one of those things you think will NEVER happen to you.
 
Sorry to hear the news! You definitely have my thoughts/prayers from over here!! I've just been reading up on IBD....its awful news that your collection has it :(. I'm going to do some more research and ask one of my snake proffs about it- I'll let you know if I come across anything that might be useful.

I guess this is just one of those moments when life doesn't seem fair...I wish you the best in enjoying the wonderful snake collection you have left.
 
Thanks Calift. I know what needs to be done. I know what situation I am in. And I know that admiting I have IBD in my collection will tarnish my name for snakie eternity. But I am going to draft a thread will all my notes, pictures, vet reports and evidence to try and educate people on my experience with this disease and the precautions I have been advised to take by my vet and the descisions I have made for myself. I am doing this responsibly and in the most sensible way possible. If I can raise a little awareness of how destructive and serious IBD is then perhaps others can prevent their collections from being infected.

The simple fact is once you have IBD in your collection you can never be sure it's not lurking until all the snakes within the collection at the time have been dead and burried for at least a year.
 
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