As I’m reading along I keep telling my self, just be quiet, let him have his say and then he will move on and bother some other site for a week or two. But he just keeps it, pushing and pushing until no human could remain silent. Somebody has got to say something.
And of course it must be you, right? Ol' righteous Wade here to save the day again, simply because there is a descenting opinion in the crowd. Have fun with that...
WOW, I read those same articles. I feel like you are reading a lot into those brief descriptions. You seem to be speaking confidently about this girls mental state. Having drawn that much information out of a couple of paragraphs, I wonder why the very people who lived with her couldn't make those kind of judgments.
Really, Wade? You really think that the only problem this poor girl had was a couple of bullies, and nothing more? Do you really think that these were the only problems in this young ladie's life?
Or do you think, perhaps, that like most suicidal individualas, this young lady suffered through a string of depressions only partly related to the bullying that continued on, unnoticed and untreated, until the cumulative emotional strain caused her to snap?
Think about it, Wade. No, I mean
really think about it. I'm not reading into "brief descriptions", I'm making very reasonable assumptions about what the majority of suicidal teenagers true problems are...
So now you assumption becomes fact and we will build our case on that fact. Now that you have diagnosed the problem you feel you understand the situation well enough to judge the parents and the school system. It speaks harshly of your failings but I am not blaming you. But based on your assumption you now want to prescribe psychological evaluation.
So what...Acute Depression isn't a life-threatening mental shortcoming? Or she wasn't depressed and suffering?
Quite simple really...people that have a strong self-esteem, strong self-confidence, and the mental capacity to face the daily struggles of a hard life don't kill themselves, for any reason. No matter how painful it might be, they wake up every morning and face a new day.
Of course I am assuming she was depressed. You could very well be right, Wade. She may very well have been a perfectly happy, happy, and self-confident young woman that just decided to up and kill herself one day.
Chris, are you a noted authority on teen suicide? Are these statement you give us as fact backed by any kind of research or is this just you assessment based on your opinions? When you say "the vast majority" it sounds like there must be some kind of research to back that up.
Authority? Nah. It was something that I did a lot of reading, researching, and actually
talking to suicidal teens about during my time in college. Despite what you and your friends might think of me, Wade, I do actually have a practical education and several years of practical experience dealing with kids and teens in troubled situations, counseling suicidal adolescents and suicide survivors, and victims of abuse, depression, suicidal tendencies, and a myriad of other childhood-related stress issues.
There is research to back that information up. You want it? Use Google...
I know what is missing, it's the words, In My Opinion.
Actually, I should have put "in my experience", after dealing with the suicide of an uncle, a cousin and three very close friends during and shortly after high school, I can assure you that all 5 of them, at least, would have done it regardless of the excuse they gave. The ones that I talked to...didn't succeed. Some tried again later with varying levels of success, and some regained control of their emotions and turned their lives around...
I kind of feel like the articles I read gave us very little information to make any kind of judgement. Your opinion of wrong doing is based strictly on the scenario you have created here which may have absolutely nothing to do with the actual case being discussed.
And herein lies part of the problem...there is nothing in the articles to suggest what sort "bukllying" was taking place. There was nothing in the articles, save for a small sidebar about the charges, that discussed the level of bullying that went on.
Nothing, in other words, to suggest criminal activity, save a small sidebar listing charges. Nothing listing evidence or eye-witness accounts. So why is it OK to assume that the bullies must have been terroristic in their efforts to stalk and harrass her, but not to assume that it was just regular bullying? As far as I can see, there is no evidence to support either one, except for the mention of charges.
Of course, it mentions charges, but doesn't make any mention of evidence, or what, specifically, the charges relate to, does it...
Oh you have got to love this. Now the young ladies short comings are the problem and the 9 bullies are the victims. That is fantastic. You have out done yourself here.
Ahh...I was wondering when the word twisting would being. Please...show me where I excused the behavior of the bullies and called them victims. I am asking you very nicely to point out where those words appear in ANY post I've made in this topic...
Fact is, Wade, I made neither claim. Another prime example of you twisting things around to make them fit what you would like them fit, rather than what they actually say. You're a real piece of work.
I can't imagine why anyone would pick on you Chris. I mean with your people skills I am surprised you weren't the class president. You learned a hard lesson and came away with skills that will help you get though the rest of your life. Did it occur to you to wonder why these "bullies" were always picking on you. There must have been other kids they could have picked on.
Oh, I know why they picked on me. They picked on me because my family was poor, we wore second-hand clothes, we were on public assistance while both parents worked 2 jobs each to try and make ends meet, because they knew about my uncle's suicide, and my cousin, and because kids are mean. It's the way of the world.
And while my "people skills" may not be up to your standard, I can assure you that they work just fine. Remember...I'm not the one that would tell racially biased jokes to anyone, anywhere, anytime. I'm not the arrogant, rude, racist, and offensive individual that never says things to one group of people that he wouldn't say to another. That would be you.
Fact of the matter is we don't even know from the article that this child had parents. We don't know any of the mitigating circumstances. We don't know weather this child was going to daily psychological counseling. We don't know a lot of things. It's good we have you here to make the necessary assumptions that we can now hear your conclusion.
Well, accdording to the article we know that the school did not protect her or he;lp her. I assume she has parents that are present in her life, in one form or another. Foster, step, adoptive...some sort of parental figure that would be watching her and providing her daily nutritional and housing needs.
So while you may be right that her biological parents weren't around, it is a very reasonable assumption that there was some sort of parental figure in her life. And if she was going to counseling everyday, and the counselor was unaware of any deeper issues causing her to be suicidal, than the counselor failed her, too.
See that part I put in bold? That's very important. Watch how this works, Wade...
You're right. We don't know
squat about the situation. We don't know that these bullies did anything outside of schoolyard taunting for certain. We don't know that this girl wasn't a drug addict. We don't know if she was under the influence of narcotics when she took her life. We don't know if she had a history of mental illness, a family history of suicide, or other incredibly traumatic possibilities that other adolescents throughout the history of the world have had to deal with.
Does that make it OK to assume that everyone else is completely blameless except the kids being charged? Is your pile of assumptions some how more accurate or better than mine? I'll answer for you, Wade...no, it isn't. Your crap pile of assumptions is no better than my crap pile of assumptions.
Maybe what we could do is teach people how to work and play well with others. Maybe there is more to survival in society than toughening up physically and mentally. Maybe we could teach people how to get what they need without taking it from others. Maybe teaching people to cooperate would solve problems for bullies and the bullied. Maybe if your teachers had taught you to communicate in a way that others didn't find offensive, you would find more people agreeing with you rather than arguing with you
That would be lovely, Wade. perhaps if the teachers and parents of the world taught their children how to properly interact with each other, things like this would never happen. Oh wait...I think that would place the blame on the parents and teachers, and administrators and educators, wouldn't it? Isn't that what I said?
Bishop, California. It's a small town. I'm easy to find. Care to give me an education? To be perfectly honest with you, I find it incredibly entertaining that you find me offensive. I find you ridiculous, so I guess we are even...again. I may not be soft spoken, and meek enough for your taste, Wade, but at least I will
always back up my words.
That, and I am not a racist, offensive, arrogant, rude, and insensitive individual that tells racist jokes regardless of whom it might offend... That is what you said, isn't it? You don't say anything to a of friends that you wouldn't say to anyone anywhere? Remember that? Or did you tweist that around and block it out so you can continue to feel superior?
