Now THIS Is How I Remember CS.com!

[Susan]

Kudos to all involved! This is a perfect example of how this forum used to be!

http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46873

Instead of alot of what has been happening lately, this newbie was warmly greeted with immediate help and advice!

 

[Roy Munson]

That's heartwarming, but half the time, Nanci's suggestion that the thread be moved to the appropriate sub-forum would have been met with something along the lines of:

Nanci, I came her for help, not a lecture! If ur not going to help, then don't reply!!

It wouldn't have surprised me to see this response to Elle's reply:

Tula! You didn't have to be snotty and sarcastic by capitalizing "OF COURSE"!! Im looking for help, not attitude!!

I don't think that thread is exceptional in any way. When people are polite and willing to listen, things go well. :shrugs:

 

[Duff]

That's heartwarming, but half the time, Nanci's suggestion that the thread be moved to the appropriate sub-forum would have been met with something along the lines of:



It wouldn't have surprised me to see this response to Elle's reply:



I don't think that thread is exceptional in any way. When people are polite and willing to listen, things go well. :shrugs:

The difference here is the suggestions were given in a calm and polite way, leaving out the wise**s comments and blatant rude sarcasm that normally starts the negative responses. What should have been a good thread pointing out the positive, you jump in and try to shoot it down. Being polite works both ways.

 

[Susan]

That's heartwarming, but half the time, Nanci's suggestion that the thread be moved to the appropriate sub-forum would have been met with something along the lines of:



It wouldn't have surprised me to see this response to Elle's reply:



I don't think that thread is exceptional in any way. When people are polite and willing to listen, things go well. :shrugs:

There are a multitude of things, all of them critical in nature, that could have been said as replies in that thread...but they were not said, not yet anyway and not in the now-typical manner you referred to. And I, personally, thought it was worthy of mention. Many times, it is how something is said, or even said at all, that is most important.

I've walked away from my computer, thought things out, done several re-writes and have still decided to post this as a reply instead of a private message. IMO, it is responses exactly like yours to my thread that you've referred to and I found lacking in the other thread. Instead of seeing the good things, you immediately went to the bad ones, and in the process, hurt my feelings and made me defensive enough to have to wait and calm down before replying. That thread may have not been exceptional in your opinion, but I thought it set a good example and was worthy of mention.

I apologize for the tone of my reply, but this is, IMO, another good example (but of what could go wrong) and is also worthy of mention. You are entitled to your opinion, I honor your right to have them, and value your opinion as well. You are a valued member of this forum and I consider you as much of a friend as is possible. And as a friend, I only ask that you treat my opinions with the same respect. I have calmed down quite a bit since I first read your response, and a good portion of me says not to submit this reply as currently written. However, part of me is still hurt and upset enough that it wants to delete the whole thread. Therefore, I will do one more read-through and submit this "as is".

Dean, you're still my friend, but I think you're too close to Joe now and he's rubbing off on you!

 

[Susan]

The difference here is the suggestions were given in a calm and polite way, leaving out the wise**s comments and blatant rude sarcasm that normally starts the negative responses. What should have been a good thread pointing out the positive, you jump in and try to shoot it down. Being polite works both ways.

OK...I'm not overly sensitive after all! Thank you for seeing what I saw and posting it while I was "away" composing my own response.

 

[ghosthousecorns]

I guess if you are hyper-sensitive then so are a lot of us other 'bleeding hearts' who like to see new snake owners get positive help and be made to feel welcome even though they might have made mistakes. I too remember how this is the way it used to be and the way I wish it would be again.

 

[desertanimal]

I'm a little confused about why you feel hurt, Susan. On one side, we have posters who behave like the ones you allude to. On the other side, we have posters who behave as Dean alluded. Dean was just pointing out that the O.P. was polite, coherent, and listened to suggestions, and that the respondents you refer to who can sometimes be argumentative usually respond quite well to such posters (which I think is probably true on average). You were pointing out that the sometimes argumentative respondents weren't, and that it was nice (which is also true). The two of you are really just focusing on the two sides of the same coin, and as a third reader, I didn't see that Dean was challenging or insulting to you or even arguing with you. You see one side of that coin as the cause of the problem, Dean sees the other side of the coin as the cause of the problem. No biggie.

And, Dean certainly couldn't be called impolite in his response. He expressed a dissenting opinion, sure, but he certainly wasn't impolite about it. I don't know if that's what you were implying or not, Duff. But if you were, I politely disagree!

edited to add: Also, remember that Dean was here when the forum was "like it used to be," too. And I'm sure (I infer from his post count) he posted just as much then as he does now, so I don't think his posts--dissenting or not--are the source of the problem of the forum not being like it used to be.

 

[kathylove]

I see valid points on both sides of the argument. I certainly don't want to waste my time helping somebody with a bad attitude. Especially considering it is likely to be a one-way street - those asking the basic questions are unlikely to be able to help answer questions for me anytime in the near future. I have no problem with that - I consider it to be giving back something for the next generation. But I do have a problem if there is a bad attitude and lack of respect for my time by refusing to use understandable English, needing deciphering before answering.

However, I may give the poster the benefit of one or two posts with a LITTLE attitude before I decide they are not worth my time. But it is also not worth my time to get drawn into a flame war or big argument that will only cause me stress and won't help the situation. So I usually choose to leave, or not to get involved in the first place. When I do so, I do feel sad that I can't really give the poster info that would help get their questions answered (such as using real English or BE NICE!) But at that point, I can see they are not ready to hear such advice, or have already heard it and don't think it is important, so they will have to learn on their own.

At any rate, I think that once somebody starts to show that they will be difficult to work with, maybe the new moderator could politely point out the likely problem, then everyone else could just leave them alone until they are ready to behave themselves and become a valued member of our community - or to leave because nobody will play their games. It is really difficult not to reply in kind when somebody is showing attitude, but I think doing so only escalates the thread until it becomes very unpleasant. Somebody has to be the "bigger person" - and the newbie has no stake in this community (yet), so we (the "lifers", lol!) are the ones hurt by an abundance of these threads.

I am not a confrontational type person, but I will quietly try to do me best to encourage what I think is beneficial behavior, and to try to ignore (as much as possible) the bad behavior to avoid reinforcing it.

 

[Tula_Montage]

Kudos to all involved! This is a perfect example of how this forum used to be!

First of all thank you Susan for seeing something worthwhile in the behaviour of the participents in this post.

HOWEVER I agree that if I were to point out petty spelling, grammar and punctuation mistakes she has made AS WELL as my reply it would be an entirley different story. I am not a nazi about these things, however I felt "uncomfortable" about writing my reply. This person could possibly have taken the advice and shoved it in my face. Presentation is key IMO.

But it seems that it may indeed have helped a little and thats all that matters. When it comes to little weirdo snake speices, I'll try my best to help others who share my passion for them

I think its just a matter of right people, right place, right time.

 

[Silent Screamer]

Well i guess i started something with my crappy english skills even though i am pure english, i was in a rush. i wanted to get my snake the proper conditions for it to have a good healthy life as soon as possible. I realise that my spellin and gramar is as good as what my boa could do. but i take adivce. i am a memeber of many forums, ranging from 3d car design(were coments com from really nasty to very helpfull) to gecko spot uk(very helpfull people by the way). i dont really care that i was told to move the forum, it is needed to keep order in a website such as this. i just wanted my snake to be healthy as soon as possible and it seams to be working he looks much better already, thanks too all here.

 

[Tula_Montage]

Well i guess i started something with my crappy english skills even though i am pure english, i was in a rush. i wanted to get my snake the proper conditions for it to have a good healthy life as soon as possible. I realise that my spellin and gramar is as good as what my boa could do. but i take adivce. i am a memeber of many forums, ranging from 3d car design(were coments com from really nasty to very helpfull) to gecko spot uk(very helpfull people by the way). i dont really care that i was told to move the forum, it is needed to keep order in a website such as this. i just wanted my snake to be healthy as soon as possible and it seams to be working he looks much better already, thanks too all here.

Why can't ALL new members be so cooperative and lovely? :shrugs:

So glad to hear hes already doing better, you must keep us updated from time to time

 

[Roy Munson]

Dean, you're still my friend, but I think you're too close to Joe now and he's rubbing off on you!

:roflmao: Thank you, my friend. I'm a bit too serious today (could you tell?), and this was just what I needed to snap out of it! :cheers:

The difference here is the suggestions were given in a calm and polite way, leaving out the wise**s comments and blatant rude sarcasm that normally starts the negative responses. What should have been a good thread pointing out the positive, you jump in and try to shoot it down. Being polite works both ways.

Thanks Mr. Positivity. I'll be reviewing your entire posting history for more tips on politeness and being positive. :grin01:

 

[Susan]

:roflmao: Thank you, my friend. I'm a bit too serious today (could you tell?), and this was just what I needed to snap out of it! :cheers:

Glad I could be of help! We ALL need it every now and then! I'm happier now too! :cheers:

 

[Joejr14]

Glad I could be of help! We ALL need it every now and then! I'm happier now too! :cheers:

Don't mind her, Dean. Susan is just mad because I moved away from HER.
:grin01:

 

[Duff]

Thanks Mr. Positivity. I'll be reviewing your entire posting history for more tips on politeness and being positive. :grin01:

I'll be the first to admit I'm not perfect and I had some bad moments in the past. I was also able to see how I was and become a better person for it. Maybe that's why now I can see how much a difference the right attitude can make. But if you're really that petty, have fun digging. :cheers:

 

[ghosthousecorns]

Nobody's perfect. It takes a bigger man to realize you have made a mistake and admit it rather than stick to your guns right or wrong.
I seriously doubt Dean is really the type to go dig through all your posts to put you in a negative light!
As for newbies, I am probably famous (or infamous) for defending them on here. I will probably continue to do so whether or not it's a popular cause. I know there is a percentage out there who will not take advice well, I just hate the 'guilty until proven innocent' thing, I don't like the generalization that all people will be bad herp keepers because they make a mistake once. Giving people the benefit of the doubt is a good thing, it's the old golden rule as well, let him who is without sin cast the first stone etc.
I've been here since 2004, so when I say I remember the way it used to be that goes back a ways. I sure made my share of dumb posts and getting defensive in the beginning. If I have stuck around that's because of the people who went out of their way to see beyond that and make me feel welcome.

 

[Nanci]

Thank you Susan- just trying to help and get SilentScreamer to an area where I think Viper Boa owners are more likely to be reading. I _hope_ you weren't, as Desert Animal implies, pointing out that my behavior was unusual for me and that I am more normally argumentative. Maybe about the topic of tasering, yes, I do take law enforcement topics personally, but that's it, AFAIK.

And I didn't even really notice SilentScreamer's failure to capitalize "i" or a couple spelling errors. The only thing that I really can't stand is chat speak. I tend to skip those posts until the person reverts to normal.

I think Dean's post was interesting- it did _used to be_ that way. Maybe we changed a little after the giant thread.

Let's all hug now!

Nanci :grin01: :grin01: :sidestep:

 

[Tula_Montage]

Let's all hug now!

What a nice thought... e-huggles and stuffs!

Seriously though, this place needed a wee lift! Thanks again Susan :cheers:

 

[Susan]

No Nanci, I wasn't pointing out any unusual behavior for you. In fact, you don't stand out in my mind as someone who is normally argumentative! I was simply complimenting you on how you nicely directed Silent Screamer to the forum where he would perhaps get more responses by those with experience with viper boas. On another day, he might have been told that "this is a CORNSNAKE forum, that he should not have posted that question in that particular forum and that he needs to go to the General ChitChat forum", and all of that with an attitude. And that is just scratching the surface of the things that might have been said.

desertanimal - Don't ask me why I didn't read your post before...must have been a temporary mental block. Why were my feelings hurt? I created this thread because I was genuinely pleased about the first three responses to that particular thread. Dean responded with "I don't think that thread is exceptional in any way." Now if you wouldn't feel a bit hurt if someone said that about something you were happy about, then you are indeed a tough-skinned person and I admire that in my current, hormonally induced, emotional state.

Joe Sweetie - You know how much I miss you! And yes, I'm a little jealous of Dean now.

And Silent Screamer - You have no idea what you have innocently walked into! You've been a wonderful newbie and I hope we don't scare you away with all this. As advice, all I can offer you, right now, for this particular topic (not your boa inquiry) are these words of wisdom from the Skipper: "Just smile and wave, Private! Smile and wave."

 

[kathylove]

And just so that nobody thinks absolutely perfect English is required - it is not. All of us make little typos or mistakes now and then. I ALWAYS use the spell check, even though I am pretty good at that sort of thing. But spell check won't catch EVERYTHING. My posts are not absolutely perfect either, but I do proofread and spell check each one because I feel that what is written for all to see, and to remain for all time, reflects upon the person who wrote it.

It is the messages that can't even be read without stopping to try to figure out what they mean that I tend to ignore. Those kinds of messages mean (to me, anyway) that the poster feels the reader's time is less valuable than the poster's time in trying to spell out proper English. I certainly do not fault anyone for an occasional lapse in spelling or grammar, especially if it is something that can't be caught by the spell check. Not everyone is good at the same things (just don't ask me to do anything with numbers, lol!)